Secrets to Optimizing the Customer Experience with Christine Deehring

Secrets to Optimizing the Customer Experience with Christine Deehring TW

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In this episode of the Customer Service Secrets Podcast, Gabe Larsen is joined by Christine Deehring from Bump Boxes to explore the secrets to optimizing customer experience. Founder and CEO of the world’s #1 pregnancy subscription service, Bump Boxes, Christine Deehring, is driving a company with exemplary customer service agents to help ease the pregnancy process of expecting mothers. Delivering helpful products tailored to each mom’s individual needs and how far along they are in their pregnancy, Christine’s team is there every step of the way. From the moment a mom signs up, to post-birth, her agents are there to help, improve, and ease the strain of pregnancy in the months leading up to delivery. Learn how Christine successfully elevates her customer service team’s efforts by listening to the podcast below.

Uplifting and Empowering Through Corporate Culture

Christine first starts by elaborating on their company’s focus on the mother. Keeping the expecting mother in mind, Christine notes how her team has had great success with customer happiness by listening to customer feedback and adapting their products to the mother’s needs. She states, “Our mission has always been to make mom’s life easier. So I think anyone that’s growing and scaling a business really has to kind of focus on their customer within whatever niche that they’re in and make all of the decisions based around what the customer wants.”

Along with focusing on the mother or customer, she believes that when a company hosts a corporate culture of empowerment, it results in the best possible customer service experiences. She explains, “If you do the culture right, then you can empower your customer experience team to make those quick decisions, make your customer happy, and really empower them to make it happen and make it happen quickly.” To keep an uplifting environment, her company has adopted four core values that they practice in every element of business (PHAM). The first being Positivity. For her team, positivity means constantly looking for an opportunity to brighten every interaction. Second is Hustle. Her team is always hustling and looking for ways to break CX barriers. The third value is Accountability and taking responsibility for your actions. Christine understands that everyone makes mistakes and she urges her team to use their mistakes as a learning opportunity. The fourth and most important value is Mom First. As mentioned above, the mom is in every element of their business, from packaging, marketing, and phone calls. This can also apply to every aspect of their business because it is embracing a customer-centric model of CX operations.

Don’t Be Afraid to Start From Zero

Building a company from the ground up is no easy task, especially now that the world has experienced quite the paradigm shift. In this new pandemic climate, it’s more difficult than ever to focus on a company and to build one from scratch. Every business starts with an idea and it’s the action of getting that idea off the ground that can introduce entrepreneurs to multiple roadblocks. Elements such as location, funding, and product development are just a few examples of the many things new businesses have to take into consideration. Being an entrepreneur herself, Christine encourages new entrepreneurs, “If you have an idea, take it and go. The first step is just going. And don’t be afraid if you start with zero. Everybody starts with zero.” There’s no shame in starting from zero, everyone has to start from scratch and climb their way up. It’s the choice of taking what is available and making something great out of it that differentiates the successful ideas from the other ones.

Be There For Your Customer Every Step of the Way

At Bump Boxes, customer support doesn’t just start with the customer’s problem and end with the CX agent’s solution. Customer support starts from the moment the mom-to-be signs up for the monthly subscription and continues on throughout the life of their subscription. After delivery, Bump Boxes change to Busy Boxes, which come with items to help create a fun and engaging environment for mom and her newborn baby. When discussing the methods in which her CX team continually shows up for their customers, Christine explains:

When you sign up with us, you’ll get a call from one of our moms in our customer experience team. And it’s a call, it has really nothing to do with the subscription. It’s more like, “Hey mom, how are you? How are you doing?” We know pregnancy, it can be stressful. There’s so many things going on in a woman’s life when she’s pregnant and so it’s, “Hey, we just want to be there for you. If you’re craving something, we’ll find a place to get it.

Creatively engaging with the mother and being there for every step of the pregnancy process has proven to keep their customers coming back for more. Christine notes how Bump Box has a room full of sonograms and baby pictures sent in by the mothers they service. They become familiar with each mom and enjoy speaking with them as if they are old friends. For Christine, the most rewarding part of running her company is seeing the pictures and sonograms of these babies and knowing her company did something to help each mom through their pregnancy journey.

CX teams would be wise to adopt an understanding of their customers and to thoroughly engage and have genuine conversations with them. At the end of the day, everyone is going through their own journey in life and recognizing that aspect will help add more of a human element to each CX interaction.

To learn more about the secrets to optimizing customer experiences, check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode below, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

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Full Episode Transcript:

Secrets to Optimizing the Customer Experience | Christine Deehring

Intro Voice: (00:04)
You’re listening to the Customer Service Secrets podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen: (00:11)
All right, welcome everybody. We’re excited to get going today. We’re going to be talking about customer experience and how to optimize it and to do that we brought on Christine Deehring. She’s currently the Founder and CEO of a cool company called Bump Boxes. So Christine, thanks for joining. How are you?

Christine Deehring: (00:27)
Yes. Great. I’m just so excited to be here, Gabe. So excited about the customer experience and just everything that we do here at Bump Boxes.

Gabe Larsen: (00:36)
Yeah, this is so fun because we’re always looking for, sometimes we talk about just general best practices, but it’s always fun to hear from somebody who’s kind of just daily living it, working the grind, et cetera. So we appreciate you jumping on. Before we do, can you tell us just real quick a little bit about yourself and Bump Boxes, just so everybody kind of knows the context?

Christine Deehring: (00:54)
Yeah, absolutely. So Bump Boxes is a monthly subscription service for pregnancy and baby products. So mom can sign up at any point during her pregnancy and she actually gets a box of products that are specifically tailored to that month of her pregnancy. So we include five to eight full-size products and we know what moms are going through during pregnancy and what she’s experiencing every single month. So it’s themed around something she’s going through during that specific month. And then when she gives birth, it transitions over to Busy Boxes, which is a newborn to three-year-old subscription. So, and on that side of the subscription, it’s all tailored around baby’s milestones and really creating that fun, playful environment for mom and baby to experience together. Yeah, so that’s, yeah, absolutely.

Gabe Larsen: (01:38)
I was telling Christine before, my wife has somehow convinced me to have four, so we have four children and so she’s definitely a fan of the idea and Bump Boxes. So love what you do. So [inaudible] that we had connected was Christine had come across a couple of things and one was something that was awesome that happened on Instagram. I mean, remind me. You guys went just, you flew up. You added a couple thousand followers just in a day or two. What was that scenario? Remind me.

Christine Deehring: (02:06)
Yes. Yes. So I think we had reached a milestone on our Instagram following and just to kind of give you guys some context and the whole post was all about how like, “Hey, we started from zero four years ago,” and that’s just it. So, that was the whole premise of posting about that big milestone for us on Instagram, because a lot of people don’t know. I mean, we started about four and a half years ago and we started from an idea, right? And now we reach over 14 million moms a month across all of our channels, right? So, I mean, it’s just kind of, “Hey,” like, I mean, it’s just, and what we try to say is like, “Hey guys, if you have an idea, take it and go, like the first step is just going. And don’t be afraid if you start with zero. Everybody starts with zero,” that’s that.

Gabe Larsen: (02:53)
I love that. Sometimes it’s ready, fire, aim, right? You just have –

Christine Deehring: (02:57)
Yes! You just have to aim.

Gabe Larsen: (02:57)
– and then you figure out where the target is later. But one of the keys it sounded like, and I’m sure the product is fantastic, but you guys do have kind of this maniacal focus on customer service and customer experience and interaction with the customer. And so it sounded like in the post, obviously you found a great niche that a lot of people are excited about, but you’ve kind of taken those extra steps to really bring the customer down the journey with you has been the separator. Is that fair to say?

Christine Deehring: (03:27)
Absolutely, absolutely. A hundred percent. So, I mean, I think, we do a lot of things regarding customer experience here at Bump Boxes. Our mission has always been to make mom’s life easier. So I think anyone that’s like growing and scaling a business really has to kind of focus on their customer within whatever niche that they’re in and make all of the decisions based around what the customer wants, right? I mean, that’s just the foundational way to run a business. But I mean, there are some things that we’ve learned along the way, especially growing and scaling, as to why it is just that important to really focus and have that non stop focus on your customer. So I think, one of the main things that we focused on is corporate culture, company culture. Because if you have the right culture, then you can actually empower your customer experience team to make those quick decisions to make mom happy.

Gabe Larsen: (04:21)
Right. Because a lot of times we– I feel like we should probably, when we talk about customer experience, we should probably talk more about the employee or the company culture. Sometimes we do all the things that the customer does, but we get that employee side. So, what are some of the fun things you guys have done to try to make that employer culture really enable or empower that customer journey?

Christine Deehring: (04:40)
Yeah, so our company culture is just amazing. So, we have four main core values and that’s what we make all of our decisions based around. So, positivity would be the first one. So, seeing the opportunity, seeing the brighter side of things. Always just trying to be positive in every situation possible and really seeing opportunity where it is. Hustle would be another one. So, constantly, just if there is a barrier, figure out a way to break through it or go around it, but figure out a solution. Constantly, yeah. Constantly move forward. Accountability is another one. So, being accountable for yourself, for your role. We know mistakes happen, everyone makes mistakes, right? I mean, we know mistakes happen, but when a mistake happens, we take, yeah. You take responsibility of it and then you fix it, so it doesn’t have to happen again in the future, you know? And as long as you fix the process, then everything’s great. And then most importantly, mom first, so that’s very customer experience-centric, right? So, everything we do, whether it’s our marketing messaging, whether it’s our site, our customer experience team when they talk to mom on the phone, how we pack the boxes, the product that we select, everything is putting mom first. And as long as we make our decisions around that, then we know we’re doing right by mom. So, that’s one of the main things and actually spells PHAM, so that wasn’t actually intended by design. It just worked out. PHAM with the P-H.

Gabe Larsen: (06:08)
Sometimes they have fun acronyms and you nailed it. You beat me to it. PHAM. That’s cool.

Christine Deehring: (06:10)
That’s right. That’s right. So that’s one of the main things I think, if you do the culture right, then you can empower your customer experience team to make those quick decisions, make your customer happy, and really empower them to make it happen and make it happen quickly.

Gabe Larsen: (06:26)
I like that. Now, I think some of the things that people struggle with. Because some people come up with big, they get to that step where they come up with some of these core values. It’s actually the ability to implement more, to empower the people to do them. Is there certain, you don’t necessarily need to go through each one, but have you been able to find ways to actually make those values and bring them to life? Is it communication with the team? Is it just highlighting them in a weekly meeting? Is it giving it an award around or what’s been the way to bring those to life and make them so they’re not just the things on the wall?

Christine Deehring: (06:58)
Yeah. Because yeah. I mean, like you can post them, but it doesn’t necessarily mean that like that’s the actual culture, right? I mean that’s yeah, a hundred percent. So, for us, I mean I think, we have weekly one-on-ones where we talk about core values. That’s how your performance is reviewed. It’s all around core values. It’s all driven around that. And then we also do gift cards. So, if someone exceeds in core values and they exceed their metrics and they’re nominated for a gift card award that we do every week. So, there’s ways to reinforce it, but I mean, I think that when you start off with your core values and you make your hiring decisions based on those core values you make all the decisions within the company, as long as that’s the cornerstone of why you make those decisions, then it’s easy and everyone gets it and everybody’s on par with it. Yep.

Gabe Larsen: (07:48)
Yeah, I like that one. The one that I find the most intriguing at the moment is the mom first, what was it called? How did you phrase that again?

Christine Deehring: (07:55)
Mom first. Yeah.

Gabe Larsen: (08:00)
Okay, because it sounded like, and again I’m thinking about some of the posts you guys have. You’ve done some fun things to kind of, it’s not just, “Here’s a box, good luck,” right? There’s these little cherry on tops, these little extra things you guys have done to make it personalized, make it kind of extra, make it feel like you care more. Do you mind sharing a couple of those that may come to mind?

Christine Deehring: (08:21)
Yeah, absolutely. So, we call all of our subscribers personally. So, when you sign up with us, you’ll get a call from one of our moms in our customer experience team. And it’s a call, it has really nothing to do necessarily with the subscription. It’s more of like a, “Hey mom, how are you? How are you doing?” Like we know pregnancy, it can be stressful. There’s so many things going on in a woman’s life when she’s pregnant and so it’s like, “Hey, we just want to be there for you. Like, if you’re craving something, we’ll find a place to get it.” Yeah. Like, whatever you need –

Gabe Larsen: (08:58)
Have there been some weird experiences where you’ve done something like that, where someone’s been like, “I’m really not doing well, I’m craving something,” and you ordered fries or something like that?

Christine Deehring: (09:07)
Yes! Yes! Oh my gosh! A hundred percent. I mean, yes. And that’s why our moms love us and what’s really cool, especially when we make those connections with mom. I think what’s so exciting to see is even in our customer experience room, I mean like, we have so many sonogram photos, so many pictures that moms have sent in. If a mom signs up with us and she’s with us her whole pregnancy and finally, she has her baby, it’s an exciting time that we all celebrate. We all get excited about and then she sends us pictures and we put them up on this wall and that’s really exciting when you know that you’ve made that connection. [Inaudible].

Gabe Larsen: (09:47)
Cool, cool. So they actually send you, just by a chance, they’ll send you a picture and you’ve kind of thrown it on the wall in the customer experience room, you said?

Christine Deehring: (09:56)
Yeah. Yeah.

Gabe Larsen: (09:56)
Awesome. I want to highlight though, the phone call. Because I do feel like, it is a small, well maybe it’s not a small thing, but this proactive customer support or proactive customer experience feels like it’s just a hot trend or a real differentiator. We’re so used to taking inbound query or the chat query or the email inquiry or the ticket, but actually taking the time to go outbound, whether it’s a challenge, a new cut, I feel like that’s pretty different. And it sounds like people appreciated that a lot.

Christine Deehring: (10:31)
Yeah, absolutely. And I think something that we’ve done too, is we have a very direct feedback loop with our customer experience team. And so I think it’s super, super important, especially as you roll out new initiatives, as you’re trying and testing things, as you’re trying to figure out exactly what’s resonating with mom and what she wants, having that contact with your customer directly and asking those questions and being in that feedback loop is super important. So, I know, recently we rolled out a VIP program. So, any mom that subscribes with us, she gets, depending on how long she’s committed to, she gets a specific discount to our store just for joining our subscription. And that was something that came up from just customer feedback, right? And so it’s definitely nice to have that instant feedback loop so that way you can make changes, you can test things, you can roll new things out just to make sure that you’re really sticking through to that mission.

Gabe Larsen: (11:33)
No, that is powerful because I think a lot of times as sales and marketing, we don’t listen to our customers enough. You want to, but you don’t get that feedback loop tightened. How have you done that? Is it the channel? I mean, are you guys pretty channel agnostic? Meaning it’s like, hey, when you have this customer experience person, you can communicate them very easily, whether it’s on tech or phone or email, or is it that you have these kind of weekly check-ins or how have you made that feedback loop more fluid?

Christine Deehring: (12:05)
Yeah, absolutely. So, I’m actually in touch with customer experience every single day. So, they actually report directly to me, you know what I mean? And we’ve done that by design. Yeah. We’ve done it by design because I think I want to be as close to our moms as possible. And I think that has been super important to our growth, right? Being able to kind of hear what’s going on on the ground. Being able to talk to moms a couple of times a week, like just to make sure that we’re still staying true to that mission, that they feel good, they’re having a great experience and then, you know, asking for ideas, like, “What else would you like to see from Bump Boxes? What other things have you thought about that would be helpful that we could provide?” and I think being that close to customer experience has really been helpful as we’ve grown and scaled and learned along the way.

Gabe Larsen: (13:00)
Yeah, sure. Because sometimes that is the hard part, right? Once you kind of lose track of the customer, you lose track of so much of that goodness. How many people, obviously there are challenging times going on and some businesses are up, some businesses are down. As you kind of think about your own business and lessons learned over kind of the last month or two, and we can kind of bring this to a close, what would be feedback or advice you’d give to people who are looking to scale and obviously be successful while times are maybe a little more difficult?

Christine Deehring: (13:30)
Yeah, absolutely. I think, when you’re kind of going through uncertain times, I think the biggest thing that you really need to focus on is over-communicating, right? Because everybody has just a heightened level of stress. I mean, there’s just a lot going on. You don’t know what everyone is going through. And so, I think just keeping that in mind and over-communicating and especially being there for your customer, having those phone conversations, and understanding that it’s quality phone conversations, right? No matter what mom’s going through, if she’s stressed out, talk to her. I think that, definitely as you’re scaling and growing, just over-communicating is always best, especially during uncertain times like these for sure.

Gabe Larsen: (14:18)
And that’s obviously true for employees as well as customers.

Christine Deehring: (14:21)
Absolutely. Absolutely.

Gabe Larsen: (14:23)
Christine, it’s fun to have you on. It’s a cool, it sounds like you found obviously a fun kind of niche that you guys are really doing well in and so congrats on that. Solving problems, making customers happy. It’s always fun to kind of see that happen. So, if someone wants to learn a little bit more about Bump Boxes or your story, what’s the best way to do that? What would you recommend?

Christine Deehring: (14:42)
Yeah! Absolutely. So you can check out bumpboxes.com. You can always shoot me an email, christine@bumpboxes.com. Let me know if you have any questions or if there’s anything I can do to help. Seriously.

Gabe Larsen: (14:54)
I love that and that’s such a cool name by the way. Kudos on like a very catchy name. That was it.

Christine Deehring: (14:59)
Thank you. Thanks. Appreciate it.

Gabe Larsen: (15:01)
Well, thanks for joining and for the audience, have a fantastic day.

Christine Deehring: (15:05)
Yeah. Thanks, Gabe. Have a good one.

Exit Voice: (15:12)
Thank you for listening. Make sure you subscribe to hear more Customer Service Secrets.

Your Guide to Delivering Quality Customer Service

woman in carriage

No matter what line of business you’re in, it’s critical to pay attention to the quality of your customer service delivery if you want to keep your customers happy. Read on to find out how much of a difference quality customer service can make — and how you can start taking action today.

Quality Customer Service, by the Numbers

The importance of delivering good customer service becomes all the more significant when it’s quantified. Consider these numbers that speak to the value of quality customer service:

What business wouldn’t want to reap the benefits of word-of-mouth exposure and loyal customers who keep coming back?

But, sometimes, the dramatic results and exciting possibilities make it easy to forget where to start. Let’s zoom out and establish a clearer vision for what quality customer service can and should be.

Before You Can Deliver a Great Customer Experience, You Need to Define It

An important first step toward delivering great customer service is understanding what quality service actually looks like — to your customers and to your employees.

What It Means to Your Customers

One way to find out what the ideal customer experience (CX) looks like is to dig into the most common customer expectations. If you understand what your audience anticipates when they reach out to a support agent, you can model your customer service systems and procedures around that vision.

We’ve previously highlighted the top 10 customer service qualities that can contribute to top-notch customer care. Here’s an overview of the characteristics your customers expect to see from support agents:

  1. Respectful: Show an appreciation for customers’ time, energy and business as well as the situation that caused them to reach out.
  2. Attentive: Use active listening skills that uncover what the customer is and isn’t saying, and show that you’re invested in helping them.
  3. Caring: Exhibit empathy and emotional intelligence to demonstrate a genuine concern for your customer’s feelings.
  4. Positive: Transform customer complaints into positive touchpoints with the brand by leading with a positive attitude and a warm, friendly tone.
  5. Patient: Demonstrate plenty of patience when attempting to fully understand someone’s frustrating situation and work toward the type of resolution that leaves them a satisfied customer.
  6. Communicative: Employ strong communication skills to ensure that your responses are as clear, informative and helpful as they can be.
  7. Knowledgeable: Be prepared and forthcoming with expert knowledge about products or services, giving your customers the support and answers they’re looking for.
  8. Determined: Prove that you’re actively committed to discovering the root of the issue and arriving at a solution that meets your customers’ needs.
  9. Creative: Use outside-of-the-box thinking and sharp problem-solving skills to tackle more nuanced and complex issues with personalized solutions.
  10. Efficient: Find ways to minimize the time and effort you put into your support services while maximizing the results to improve the customer experience.

If you’re not sure how your business stacks up against the ideal customer experience, take a look at our ultimate CX checklist.

What It Means to Your Agents

Excellent customer service starts with empowered employees. As these customer expectations show, your audience expects to interact with highly skilled agents. But having the right customer service skills is just the baseline.

Customer care agents must also possess:

  • Expertise to represent your products and services.
  • Data to gain a 360-degree view of the customer.
  • Authority to take action on behalf of a customer.
  • Tools to manage their work efficiently.

However, they won’t show up with these resources and capabilities on day one. It’s your responsibility to ensure that your staff is adequately trained and that they have access to industry-leading software solutions designed to support quality customer care delivery.

Easy Ways to Start Improving Your Customer Service Right Now

With a better idea of what superior service looks like, you can start making informed decisions and steady progress toward improving your customer service and experience. Here are some simple steps to take right away. While they don’t require too much effort, they can lead you in the right direction and result in a much-improved experience for employees and customers alike.

Get Used to Measuring Customer Service Metrics

Your customer interactions can generate valuable data — if you’re prepared to collect it. With the right insights at your disposal, you can identify service gaps, bottlenecks and other pain points for customers and agents.

For example, a high abandonment rate could mean you need to respond to each customer inquiry sooner than you do right now. A high resolution rate paired with a low satisfaction rate could indicate an issue with how customers feel they’re being treated.

If you haven’t done so in the past, take some time to craft and distribute satisfaction surveys and generate internal reports to see where things stand. Focus on measuring and interpreting these important customer service metrics (and learn more about what they mean here):

  • Customer service abandonment rate
  • Customer retention rate
  • Resolution rate
  • Average resolution time
  • First response time
  • Customer effort score (CES)
  • Customer satisfaction score (CSAT)
  • Net promoter score (NPS)
  • Sentiment analysis

Start Anticipating Your Customers’ Needs

Shifting from a reactive mindset to a proactive one can have a dramatic impact on the quality of your customer care. Getting ahead of customer needs and concerns is a great way to promote a more positive CX and better prepare your agents.

For instance, retailers heading into the holiday rush can beef up their customer support teams with seasonal employees. Companies can anticipate continued COVID-19 complications and prepare with contingency plans and clear communications.

Additionally, brands can adopt an omnichannel approach and provide customer service via phone, mobile chat and even social media. This allows customers to access the help they need no matter what device they’re using to reach out. Even better, customers can switch channels seamlessly, without skipping a beat or losing context. And companies that plan to embrace remote work for a longer duration can implement the right tools to let customer care teams work from anywhere.

Discover the Impact of Upgrading Your Customer Service Software

Bringing the vision of superior customer service to life requires the right infrastructure. Kustomer’s leading customer service CRM platform can help you achieve those goals faster and more seamlessly by providing the data, automation and customization your business needs.

To discover more, request a free demo today.
 

Empathy-Driven Customer Support with Irene Griffin

Empathy-Driven Customer Support with Irene Griffin TW

Listen and subscribe to our podcast:

In this episode of the Customer Service Secrets Podcast, Gabe Larsen is joined by Irene Griffin, to discuss building better customer relationships through an empathy-driven support model. Irene is currently leading the customer care team at FranConnect. To learn how Irene has built an incredible customer support playbook, listen to the podcast below.

A Playbook for Empathetic CX

Over the years, Irene has created a playbook that helps guide her Customer Support Team to give the best service possible by initiating genuine human interaction. The playbook was created to include strategies and processes to help employees listen to the customer and to understand their needs. Not only should the team members address the customer’s reason for calling, but they should also show the customer that they are there to help and to listen by initiating empathetic conversation. “A lot of times,” Irene states, “Folks will come in and they think they know what they want and they ask for it directly. What they really need is someone to be more helpful and more insightful and to deliver what the customer actually needs rather than what they think they want.” As her playbook has developed, it has become a repertoire of customer service secrets that she uses to develop her team and her company’s customer experience.

How to Hire CX Reps

Irene continues by explaining how her CX team is run. She focuses on team collaboration and having a cohesive dynamic. When hiring someone to join the team, the vetting process to find “premium support talent” includes other team members. Irene says, “I always have most of the team, if available, interview them as well. For me, it’s really important that my team is able to have a hand in choosing their coworker because team dynamics play just a huge role.”

To assist in the hiring process, during an interview, Irene sets up mock phone calls to see the interviewee’s initial reactions with potentially confusing customer service situations. She asks perplexing questions to draw honest responses and by doing so, she sees if the interviewee is more process focussed or end-goal oriented. For Irene, the most important part of customer interaction is the journey to the answer, or the experience, not necessarily the answer itself. This ensures more authentic and effective customer service calls. Additionally, diversity plays a big role when hiring someone to join the team. Irene talks about how you can pull from the same group of people and still have great outcomes, but she finds that a team with diverse backgrounds creates a more involved and creative environment. As companies apply these hiring principles, they will find customer service rankings improve.

Sample Call Language vs Scripted Responses

As one of her final points, Irene starts to explain her philosophy on scripted phone calls. For Irene and all customer service professionals, consistent information and customer care is important. Most companies create this consistency by creating a type of script for their reps to follow on customer calls. While Irene recognizes the importance of consistency, she feels these calls can become too robotic. Authenticity is what the customer is looking for. Her solution has been sample call language. By sharing suggestions, it put the concepts in the minds of CX reps, allowing them to then be more authentic and creative. She states, “I want my team to be natural and I want them to be themselves and that’s authentic. And I’d rather them make a mistake than sound robotic because they’re just repeating what they were told. Plus, trust your employees, because they have autonomy and they have the freedom to put their own style on it.” As companies hire the right people using some of the tactics mentioned above, the reps will have the capabilities to have quality customer service calls while still being able to provide consistent information. Sample language is a roadmap to authentic and empathetic communication with the customer.

To learn more about building better customer relationships, check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode below, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

 

Listen Now:

Listen to “Irene Griffin | Using Empathy to Connect with the Customer” on Spreaker.

You can also listen and subscribe to our podcast here:

Full Episode Transcript:

Empathy-Driven Customer Support with Irene Griffin

Intro Voice: (00:04)
You’re listening to the Customer Service Secrets Podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen: (00:11)
Alright, welcome everybody to today’s show. We’re excited to get going. We’re going to be talking about an empathy driven support model and to do that, we brought on Irene Griffin. She’s currently the Director of Customer Support at a company called FranConnect. Irene, how are you doing? Thanks for joining us.

Irene Griffin: (00:26)
Hi Gabe, thank you for having me.

Gabe Larsen: (00:27)
Yeah, this will be fun. It’s always good to talk about empathy. I’ve been feeling like I need that in my life –

Irene Griffin: (00:37)
These days especially.

Gabe Larsen: (00:37)
I need that in life and so it might be good to talk about that in support. But before we do that, tell us just real quick a little bit about yourself and your background.

Irene Griffin: (00:47)
Okay. Sure. So I have been a Director of Customer Support at FranConnect like you mentioned. I’m going on three and a half years now, and it’s been a wonderful, wonderful experience. I’ve been a hiring manager the entire time. I’ve transformed the team that I inherited and we heard a lot of lessons along the way about how to place great staff into customer support roles. So I can talk a lot about that.

Gabe Larsen: (01:12)
Then we will. We’ll be talking a little bit about that today. So let’s maybe dive in and talk high level, this empathy driven support model. What is it? I mean, give me kind of a 30 second picture overview on it.

Irene Griffin: (01:26)
So, I developed a playbook over the years, and I’ve definitely honed it along the way on how to make sure that we are staffing our customer support team to be empathy driven. And that is to listen to the customer, to understand the customer and not just sort of react to whatever request comes in the door; much like if you visit your doctor and you tell him what prescription you want. You need to give him an opportunity to say, “Well, hold on a second, what’s actually wrong? What are the symptoms?” and then let him decide on the diagnosis. And so it starts with that, making sure that you’re listening to customers. A lot of times folks will come in and they think they know what they want and they ask for it directly. What they really need is someone to be more helpful and more insightful and to deliver what the customer actually needs rather than what they think they want. So it starts there and then I just built out on making sure that the folks that I’m hiring are high energy, have great positive personalities and are comfortable in unknown territories. That’s really important. Those are, I think, some of the best indicators of premium support talent. I’ve definitely hired on skillset above personality before, and I learned a few things along the way there. I would say that if you have all the technical skills or you really know a product well or coding language well, but you’re not great at communication skills and you don’t have a high energy, you’re going to be less successful, definitely, than someone who has that high energy personality, is a great listener and communicator, but then still needs to maybe onboard. And I think as technology becomes easier to learn, easier to adopt, especially with a younger generation where it’s much more natural, learning the technology, I think is very much secondary. So when I look at resumes now as a hiring manager, I think, “Okay, that’s great that you have these skill sets and it’s a good place to start. But if on the phone, you don’t express yourself well and you don’t have high energy, I can kind of tell that you don’t have that outgoing personality.” I generally think twice now, for sure.

Gabe Larsen: (03:26)
Interesting. So, okay. You got these different, I love the idea of empathy. Ultimately there are different ways to, I think, drive customer satisfaction. But finding out what people really want and not just solving what they think they want, but kind of getting to what they really want, being able to do that in an empathetic manner definitely resonates with me. You hit on a couple of points. I want to see if we can double click on a couple of these. So, you were just talking about hiring on skills versus personality. It sounds like one thing you’ve learned is technology, especially with the younger crowd, they can learn that faster. So you do want to see if you can find the right person, the right DNA, to bring on board rather than just kind of the technology ability, et cetera. Are there certain things you’ve found when you’ve tried to do that hiring process that has helped kind of separate the top candidates from the bottom candidates? Questions you’ve asked, assessments you’ve given, any feedback or thoughts there?

Irene Griffin: (04:29)
Sure. Oh, absolutely. So what I like to do is a mock phone call and I’ll present the interviewee with some, blurry, confusing statements and see how they attack it. Put them on the spot a little bit, and I’m not looking for them to solve the puzzle. I’m looking for the interaction and the response. And so if it’s a client, if it’s, “Hey, let me break this down to make sure that I understand what you’re saying,” rather than the sort of silent, “I’m not sure.” So I think doing mock calls is a great idea for that. And then just in general, it’s really about the energy level of the team. In my experience, and I think everyone can relate to this, I’ve never chosen an airline based on customer service out of the gate, right? You choose based on pricing when you need to fly somewhere. So that’s product based selling, right? And so you’re making that sale based on the product. It’s a good price for a flight to where you need to go, but once you have a bad experience, that’s when you’re more likely to swear off the airline. And it’s probably not because the plane that you were on had bad wheels or bad wings or something like that. I mean, the airline’s done the rude thing and they haven’t worked with you. They haven’t listened to you. They’re not meeting your needs. And that’s a very visceral, very emotional response to a transaction. So for us, it’s about relationship building and it’s about that transaction with customers to make sure that they’re feeling their needs are met. So, I like to use that analogy to sort of explain that and I’ll do that along the interview process as well.

Gabe Larsen: (06:00)
Yeah. I really liked the mock call. Sometimes you can’t understand a person or know what they’re going to be like until you see them do it, and that’s part of the hard part of interviewing. You’ve got to feel it and see it and interact with them and once you do, that does make a huge difference. Do you– when you say you keep it a little more vague, is it just kind of, do you throw harder kind of customer support questions at them or are they more like a puzzle, like trying to answer like a complicated problem?

Irene Griffin: (06:33)
Actually I stick with– I don’t wanna put people on the spot so badly with puzzles. I mean, I lock up myself when I have it done to me, so I stick with more of what a sample support question might be. Where it’s just long winded, convoluted, there’s extra stuff in there and again, I’m not looking for the outcome as much as I’m just looking for the reaction and the ability to kind of parse it out and kind of stay cool and be organized.

Gabe Larsen: (06:58)
I love that. Yeah. The journey to the– it’s like you’re not looking for the right answer. The journey is the reward, right?

Irene Griffin: (07:04)
That’s correct. And then additionally, I can add, I always have most of the team, if available, interview them as well. For me, it’s really important that my team is able to have a hand in choosing their coworker because team dynamics play just a huge role. For me to know that my team trusts each other and they’re building on relationships, they’ll help each other, they’ll grab each other’s tickets without me needing to intervene, that is a big deal. That is just, I think, a really huge thing. And the right personality is going to fold into the right team really well and they’ll enjoy their workday and that translates to the customer experience immensely. When people are happy to be at their jobs, that’s a big deal for customer support.

Gabe Larsen: (07:48)
What are any other things you do to kind of help drive team dynamics? I love the interview, each other, that you can kind of interview the new people to see how well they’ll work together and kind of buy off on it so they feel like they’re part of building the team. Other activities, games, motivational things you do to kind of drive that team dynamics and make it better?

Irene Griffin: (08:08)
Sure. I think…in the pre-pandemic era, when we were all in the office together… it was certainly a lot easier to just, “Let’s go grab a coffee, let’s go grab a quick lunch.” I try not to do too much forced merriment. I think bonding should happen a little naturally, more organically. So yeah, our HR team definitely has great activities for all the employees that bring us together in different ways and we do volunteer work and we have our own internal team parties. But for me, I think mostly just keeping us on standup meetings twice a day, making sure everyone feels heard, repeating the idea of respecting teammates and stuff like that. It happens naturally. I’m happy to say I found out that they were on a happy hour and I wasn’t even invited and it made me thrilled to know that they are choosing to hang out together and even out of work, offline stuff, gaming together and stuff like that. So I think you have to let that develop in its own way.

Gabe Larsen: (09:04)
Yeah. It’s hard sometimes to force that, but sometimes it doesn’t happen naturally. That’s good to hear you guys have some support also from the top to see if you can get some of those things done. So you got a little bit about hiring, a little bit about team dynamics. You also talked about this kind of personality aspect, high energy. Is there a way you coach people to get that, or is that again, maybe more in the hiring process to make sure you find those people that are just a little more energetic, ready to go, be part of the team, et cetera?

Irene Griffin: (09:36)
So, definitely it’s part of the hiring process and that isn’t to say that I’ve only hired extroverts that are bouncing off the walls. That’s not at all what I mean. I definitely have more low key folks, but when they get on the phone with the customer, they’re coached into how to be great customer support people and how to be empathetic. It’s more about empathy, I think, than energy per se. But I do have a playbook that I’ve developed and we would sample tickets, sample phrases. I let them know that, as cheesy as it may seem, I’ll go with: “It’s my pleasure to work with you. Is there anything else I can do for you,” over “Thanks. Have a great day.” Right? It’s just that extra level of like white glove service that elevates the experience and yeah, we’re B2B. So we need to get that relationship established with our customer base. I think if you’re talking B2C and it’s transactional, I mean, you don’t need Amazon sending you flowers for buying something, right? You just want to get the transaction done and it just has to be accurate and it just has to be timely and that’s great. But with us, we’re working with the same folks over and over again. So we need to have the trust and the relationship with our customer and making sure that empathy is at the heart of every call is a big deal. So like I said, I have a playbook where we go through sample language and I make sure that the language is as positive as it can be. So if somebody wants to criticize the product or somebody wants a feature that we’re certain that we’re just not going to support, it’s not just well dismissive or, “can’t do that for you.” It’s, you know, “this is a great idea and I’ll take this to the product team, we’ll see what we can do and in the meanwhile, let’s look at workarounds or other solutions for you.” Yeah. People feel cared for when you use the right language. That’s a huge part of that playbook that I’ve got.

Gabe Larsen: (11:22)
Yeah. Yeah. So let’s, I want to hear just a little more about the playbook. One question that I’ve often heard is how much do you kind of, this word scripting. Scripting versus not scripting, or really kind of pushed certain types of responses? How have you managed that with this playbook concept?

Irene Griffin: (11:39)
So I think with scripting, I think that’s more of a call center concept with customer support teams that are working through complex issues like for example, with us and software, I don’t really adhere much to it. I think it’s more a sample language that I support plus I want my team to be natural and I want them to be themselves and that’s authentic. And I’d rather them make a mistake than sound robotic because they’re just repeating what they were told. Plus trust your employees, because they have autonomy and they have the freedom to put their own style on it. So I definitely think scripting can be great, but I think that’s more of a call center concept.

Gabe Larsen: (12:19)
Yeah. Do you feel like, so it sounds like you’ve been able to give them snippets or you use the word, playbooks, so give them plays or something that they could potentially use or sample language based on commonly asked questions or common concerns, things like that. How have you found the balance to have versus autonomy versus using these sample dialogues, et cetera, any thoughts there?

Irene Griffin: (12:45)
So I guess we do have FAQ’s and for a knowledge base, that’s really important for us to get the answer, right. It’s not just about how we are talking to customers, about whether or not we’re able to solve it on first touch. That’s also a huge part of the customer service experience. So, I think autonomy is really much more important. When you let them problem solve on their own, I think that’s really key.

Gabe Larsen: (13:07)
Yeah. Yep. In order to get them to that level, have you found, with outside of the playbook, other training aspects you’ve had to really facilitate or product training? How do you get to the people where they kind of have that balance or that capability of being able to be off the cuff and get the answers you need?

Irene Griffin: (13:25)
I think for me personally, the most successful path towards that has been shadowing. So when you have someone that’s really great at what they do, just getting your staff to watch and listen and understand that this is how we conduct ourselves. This is how we talk to customers and this is what’s expected. And then I found this to be pretty successful if you hire the right folks that get it to begin with and they understand, and I think it’s a more pleasurable experience, even for the support people to create the relationship. And then we get high marks. We get high MPS scores because our customers love the team that they’re working with. And so when I get feedback from my customer base, it’s by name, they’re naming folks that they love working with. And it doesn’t mean that we solved the problem right away. It doesn’t mean that it was a magic wand experience, but they know that we’re here and we know they know that we’re working for them, we’re working hard for them. And that honestly buys a lot of leverage with critical problems that you just need a team of technical people to resolve and it’s a little out of your hands to deliver. Maintaining that relationship really helps the customer base and keeps them– . What’s more important for me is making sure that our customers are ready and wanting to call us back again and again and so that we leave them with an experience that is a positive one. So they feel comfortable reaching out to us whenever they need us.

Gabe Larsen: (14:47)
Got it. Do you feel like, I mean, you obviously work in the B2B space and you’ve hit some of these things that kind of drive this empathetic model, other kinds of things outside of this that are keys to building customer relationships that you’ve found?

Irene Griffin: (15:00)
Oh, that’s a good question. I think just getting on the phone with them, sooner than later, is a really key component. I know today nobody just calls each other, right? You text somebody and you say, “Hey, do you have a minute to talk?” And then you set up a minute to talk and that’s sort of the appropriate etiquette these days. Just ringing someone out of the blues generally considered, –I think the phone has a huge component in hearing people’s voices and you get a lot from tone and clear up a lot of misunderstanding and get to a resolution a lot faster when you just pick up the phone and call the customer. So I think that’s another key component and you can respond to the ticket and type out your responses, but a lot of times it gives them an opportunity to talk and folks love to talk. Most of the time.

Gabe Larsen: (15:48)
A little more proactiveness, right? You know, certainly methodologies lend itself to being a little more proactive, but we can respond and email, but we could sometimes, “I’m going to try to get ahead of this one or I’m going to just get them right now,” and you’d be a little more aggressive, but sometimes that does pay off. I like that.

Irene Griffin: (16:08)
And a lot of times, to add to that, they’ll end up adding on a couple of extra questions once they’re on the phone and then deflects future tickets. So there’s a lot to it.

Gabe Larsen: (16:18)
While you got them, might as well get it all answered. Right? Get it all out of them. Do you, certainly we talked about a lot of different stuff in this model, so personality and hiring dynamics and using playbooks. If you had to kind of sum it up, as a takeaway that is the secret to having a great support team for a lot of leaders out there like yourself who are trying to navigate these challenging times, what would be kind of your closing statement or closing argument here?

Irene Griffin: (16:45)
I would say that on top of everything we discussed today about getting positive energy folks, make sure that you have a diversity of background folks as well. I think that’s just a huge thing. Nothing wrong with pulling from the same group or the same fraternity at one particular university and hiring a bunch of friends but, there’s a lot of value in dragging people from all different walks of life and all different backgrounds. I think that it gives people a more cosmopolitan or I guess, more rich background in which to work and it improves them personally. So I think that’s one of the extra takeaways in summary that I would add on top of that.

Gabe Larsen: (17:28)
And that’s very timely as well. Right? I think we’re all trying to reflect a little bit more on that and find ways to do it. It sounds like that’s been beneficial for you. So Irene, I really appreciate your time. If someone wants to get in touch with you or learn a little bit more about some of these ideas, what’s the best way to do that?

Irene Griffin: (17:45)
Yeah, absolutely. So, if you can find me on LinkedIn, I’m Irene Griffin at FranConnect, and I think that should be enough info. If you look me up, I’d be happy to link in with you and continue this conversation.

Gabe Larsen: (17:56)
Yeah. It’s always fun to continue the conversation guys. So again, Irene, thanks for taking the time and for the audience, have a fantastic day.

Irene Griffin: (18:01)
Thanks Gabe.

Exit Voice: (18:09)
Thank you for listening. Make sure you subscribe to hear more customer service secrets.

Fan-to-Fan Customer Support with Douglas Kramon

Fan-to-Fan Customer Support with Douglas Kramon TW

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In this episode of the Customer Service Secrets Podcast, Gabe Larsen is joined by Douglas Kramon, Senior Director of Fan Support & Customer Care Operations at ESPN, to discuss how customer care drives customer experience. ESPN is a world renowned sports network with an unmatched customer care system. Learn how Douglas has become so successful in customer relations by listening to the podcast below.

Fan Support

The Customer Care Operations team at ESPN has transformed the world of customer experience by creating a more empathetic relationship between the agent and the customer. By doing so, not only have they improved customer experiences, but they have made room for fan-to-fan sports discussion. The concept of the “fan” was created as a nickname for customers at ESPN to make a more relatable and human connection to the agents. Douglas states, “But deep down, when you peel that layer of the onion back, you’re speaking to a fan just like you and they’re more likely to appreciate the conversation and remain an ESPN fan if there is a human element to that.” Douglas talks about how everyone in the Fan Support department is a big sports fan and because of this, they are better able to have constructive conversations when customers reach out to ESPN Fan Support.

Improving Brand Experience During COVID-19

For many fans, sports are memories. With this in mind, Douglas’ team knows that sports bring people together and many are missing that fan-to-fan interaction. They want to keep the sports memories alive, especially during COVID-19 when live sporting events have decreased. To do this, Douglas’ team is actively searching for ways to improve the ESPN sport experience all while balancing business and working from home during a pandemic. As Douglas mentions, “Sports are all about emotion and passion and when we talk sports or fans talk sports, it’s dialogue, it’s discussion, it’s debate.” While live sporting events are minimal, his team is working to replace the experience with engaging content such as a new docuseries called The Last Dance. Continuing to better the fan experience with more interesting content, contacting through SMS, live messaging, and human interaction, Douglas’ team has seen a large increase in C-SAT.

Three Ways to Keep Agents Happy and Thriving

At ESPN, not only is it important to keep the fans happy, it’s also important to keep the Fan Support agents happy. Douglas has figured out three elements that help his team thrive in a fast paced environment: workspace, collaboration, and nutrition. He hopes to harbor a motivating workspace where daily collaboration welcomes insightful communication. In connection with the nutrition concept, Douglas talks about how his agents have families and lives outside of the work environment and he emphasizes the importance of home life. He says:

So you had a great C-SAT. You’re going to get a family size pizza arriving at your door with a little note from ESPN saying, ‘Thank you for doing what you are doing.’ With the C-SAT review directly below it and letting them know we appreciate them. That means they’re more likely to go to a comfortable workspace that they’ve set up for themselves, that they’re collaborating with others as if they’re in the center and they’re feeling good that we appreciate them.

To Douglas, happy agents are a prerequisite to happy fans and small acts make a big difference in agent and fan morale.

To learn more about how customer care drives customer experience, check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode below, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

 

Listen Now:

Listen to “Douglas Kramon | Be Brief, Be Bright, and Be Gone” on Spreaker.

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Full Episode Transcript:

Fan-to-Fan Customer Support with Douglas Kramon

Intro Voice: (00:04)
You’re listening to the customer service secrets podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen : (00:11)
All right, welcome everybody. We’re excited to jump in. We’re going to be talking about customer care driving customer experience, and to do that, we brought on Douglas Kramon. He’s currently the senior director of fan support and customer care operations at ESPN. Douglas, we appreciate you joining. How are ya?

Douglas Kramon: (00:30)
Good Gabe. Thank you so much for having me.

Gabe Larsen : (00:33)
Yeah, I think this will be fun. I mean, you’ve got a real interesting background. Obviously the company you’re working at, a lot of different changes going on there, and I want to jump into some of the ways you’ve managed around that. Still trying to drive those customers to be excited and passionate about a brand that I think really has kind of that passion innately in it. Before we do though, tell us just a little bit about yourself, your background, and then we can kind of jump in.

Douglas Kramon: (01:02)
Sure. My background is obviously when you go to college for Native American archeology and cultural anthropology, it’s natural to land at the worldwide leader of sports. That’s just what you do. It just happened. And needless to say, it’s been a wonderful time at ESPN. But, through my time post college, it’s really all been about customer experience and identifying the opportunities to improve the brand experience with the customer and what I will refer to with ESPN, we call the “fan.” ESPN is a Disney organization and so we have some serious brand prestige to try to maintain and we’re dealing with sports fans. Sports are all about emotion and passion and when we talk sports or fans talk sports, it’s dialogue, it’s discussion, it’s debate. So a lot of what I do is to make sure in my teams, the passion of sport or the passion that spans out for sport is brought closer to what they want to see.

Gabe Larsen : (02:21)
I love that.

Douglas Kramon: (02:21)
So we’re excited about that. And times have changed a little bit right now as we’re dealing with COVID-19, but that challenge still exists.

Gabe Larsen : (02:30)
Amen. Amen. So let’s get into that part of it. I mean, obviously, as you think about your current environment, it’s all about live – live sports, live everything. And that’s one of the things that drives the passion I think for the brand specifically, thinking about some of the sports ideas. Although on the Disney side, as you said, right? A lot of live interaction there, theme parks, et cetera. If you can just kind of paint the picture as to how you’re viewing it with all the changes that have gone on. Like what’s kind of going through your mind from a, “Holy smokes, the world has kind of turned and now I find myself in a very precarious place?”

Douglas Kramon: (03:14)
Yeah. It’s an excellent question. You know, going into this early to mid-March, I’m ramping up my care team to provide support for millions upon millions of college, NCAA tournaments, challenge players, looking for a college tournament. And then directly following that the beginning of major league baseball and fantasy baseball and suddenly like that, it’s all gone. So you suddenly have an opportunity and you’re ramped up accordingly for one of the most exciting months, if you will, in sports and then it just vanishes. So the live sport experience worldwide has vanished before our eyes.

Gabe Larsen : (03:59)
Man, when that NCA turned, when the big dance got canceled, I felt that one personally, because there’s sports that – I’m sorry, I didn’t mean to interrupt but I’m so passionate about this. Some of the sports, golf pro stuff, but man to see those kids who this is so important to them. They’re seniors. They’re going to the big dance, a lot of them for the first time and those pictures were just heartbreaking to see.

Douglas Kramon: (04:27)
And that’s the emotion of live sport? Is it not?

Gabe Larsen : (04:29)
It is.

Douglas Kramon: (04:29)
So knowing that, it’s disappeared and our fans feel that. It’s as if something has been ripped out of them in an incredibly difficult and challenging time already with what’s going on in the world. So removing live sport, we are working to replace the experience until it comes back with incredible content as you and I have talked about with exciting things like The Last Dance, which is now the number one viewing experience out there.

Gabe Larsen : (05:03)
For people who don’t know what that is, give them just 30 second on that.

Douglas Kramon: (05:07)
Sure, so the last dance is a docuseries about the 97-98 season of the Bulls and Michael Jordan leading that team. And really the last time that team would be together and it shows the evolution of the Bulls from the early nineties on. And of course their premier players: Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen-

Gabe Larsen : (05:34)
It’s really well done.

Douglas Kramon: (05:34)
It really is an incredible storytelling experience. It’s not a live sport.

Gabe Larsen : (05:39)
I’m on episode four.

Douglas Kramon: (05:40)
Soon enough, you got two more to go before this weekend release – I think Saturday. It’s something where passion for sport is still there and we’re seeing that. So right now we shifted from live viewing triaged, in the moment triaged, for live sport because in customer service, for what I do, we’re like a Formula One pit crew. And while all I care about is be brief, be bright and be gone. That’s true enough.

Gabe Larsen : (06:11)
I love that. Say it one more time. That’s kind of been the typical thing of customer service right?

Douglas Kramon: (06:17)
Sure. Be brief, be bright and be gone so you can get the next fan or the next customer and service them and be smart about it. We’re looking at a situation now where we use to get contacts from fans and triage, get you connected appropriately to your TV provider, allow you to view something on a larger screen, you get a lot of technical issues, or it’s lock time almost for fantasy baseball, help you with your rosters. All of that is live triaged and we have special tools where we can see what’s coming over the horizon and hit us. So we know in the moment what to be prepared for. We have great tools that turn dark data into live data and what’s coming to the sender and what folks are saying on social and everywhere. But when it suddenly shuts off the live sport tab and we have to go to video on demand, it’s a different kind of support model, but it’s one where we have the opportunity to also have fan-to-fan dialogue. We like to say, and we believe this wholeheartedly, for customer service, we are fellow fans in the stands with our fans. We’re not the suits in the suites, meaning we’re there with you. We’re sports fans just like you –

Gabe Larsen : (07:33)
I love that.

Douglas Kramon: (07:33)
– and we understand what you’re going through and if you want to talk a little sport, we do too. And that’s what we do and our C-SAT reflects that. So it’s one where we have now, interestingly enough, a little more time for that dialogue and discussion, not so much debate, and if it is, it’s off the cuff and it’s jovial. But we, like the fans we know, miss sport. And so we see it in C-SAT, they wanted to come back and we like to say, “We miss it too,” and then we talk a little sport and we move on.

Gabe Larsen : (08:10)
Okay. So I got to click into that for a minute. The typical motion has been kind of be brief, you know, get off, be gone. I liked your saying better. But now, you’re open a little more, you kind of push that based on the changes to have a dialogue because I’m missing sports, the ref’s missing sports. So is there some examples? I mean, you’re having people then kind of be like call in for a problem, but it is, I really miss my Celtics man. You Celtics fan? And next thing you know, five minutes later, we’re talking about the glory days with Garnett and winning a couple championships. Is that kind of what’s going on?

Douglas Kramon: (08:48)
Absolutely. Just yesterday for example, we have a C-SAT, customer satisfaction survey response, and I’ll tell you what the fan said. Fan gave the agent five out of five stars and said, “I called to relay a story about coach Don Shula. As you know, Don Shula passed away recently. I was a highschool coach for 47 years and I spoke about motivation for the 1972 Dolphins. Mark was very attentive, the agent Mark, to the story and he listened and he loved it. And that’s important to me. He’s a great employee for ESPN. Thank you for allowing me to share this conversation.”

Gabe Larsen : (09:29)
No way!

Douglas Kramon: (09:29)
We also have others where Alex, for example, and the fan writes to C-SAT, he was, “prompt, helpful and amazing with troubleshooting. But it sucks that he’s a Jets fan, but as the Bills are my team, I have no room to talk.” So as you can see, there’s a jovial nature and a conversational nature from our fans where you reach a care agent. You’re reaching a brand specialist who is also a brand protector. We have chatbots. We have FAQ deflectors. We have self service. We have AI in the IVR methods. Hang on, let me put my dog out real quick.

Gabe Larsen : (10:17)
You’re good! It’s the reality man, the dog [inaudible] that goes, it’s the way the world is right now.

Douglas Kramon: (10:20)
This is the new reality. I have to be here with my dog in the office. So we are brand protectors or agents. When you actually reach the live agent, it’s human-to-human interaction, fan-to-fan. And we see it in our C-SAT and Gabe, let me point out during this time since the quarantine, which is about March 15th to today. What is it we’re looking at, May 8th?

Gabe Larsen : (10:49)
Coming up on two months, coming up on two, right?

Douglas Kramon: (10:51)
Our C-SAT has never been higher. Never.

Gabe Larsen : (10:55)
That’s awesome.

Douglas Kramon: (10:56)
When you compare it to this time last year, we’re 14% higher and if you compare it to the 40 days prior to 45 days prior to that, we’re 9% higher and it’s because our agents are showing a dialogue, empathy, understanding, compassion, and letting fans know we miss it too. We miss-

Gabe Larsen : (11:18)
I love that. So a couple of follow ups on that one is, how do you find p– How do you find agents like that? I mean, I feel like I’d be a good agent-

Douglas Kramon: (11:26)
You would, I bet you would.

Gabe Larsen : (11:26)
– in one of your operations because I watch ESPN– Well, I did watch it religiously every night just to be kind of up on the latest because I like to have kind of the, what do they call it? The cooler room talk-

Douglas Kramon: (11:40)
Absolutely! The water cooler talk.

Gabe Larsen : (11:40)
– the water cooler talk. How do you find these people, do you actually screen for fools like me who loves sports or what’s kind of the –

Douglas Kramon: (11:51)
Well, the answer is an absolute yes. So you have to pass a sports test to work at ESPN and customer service and ultimately you have to show passion for sport in the interview. We would like you to know fantasy football or baseball or basketball or hockey. You don’t need to know them all. Then we ask for a sports story and Gabe, for example, I’m a Jets fan. It’s challenging to be a Jets fan because the Jets are at the bottom of the barrel most of the time. So it’s one day they won’t be, but we’re suffering Jets fans. Our feeling is this. You love your team because they’re yours, not because they’re great. I want a story from every agent that tells me what they love about their favorite sports star, the game, their team, their love of a specific event. Like they watched the 1980 Olympics hockey team, USA hockey win. And tell us a story. I need to know that you’re connected to sport.

Gabe Larsen : (13:02)
I love that. When you get someone to tell that story, I’m sure it can come out. You can just gauge very quickly kind of the passion and the realness about stories. Do you want to hear my story, Doug?

Douglas Kramon: (13:13)
Of course.

Gabe Larsen : (13:13)
I’m thinking of The Last Dance. I’ll make this one brief. I don’t remember if it was ’97 or ’98, but I’m from Salt Lake City, Utah. I’m thinking Jordan game six, Byron Russell, driving to the whole Jordan memory. Jordan does that push and he sinks it and puts Utah out of it again. I mean, Utah is never going to win an NBA championship. They had their chance, but obviously they had to come against the Jordan era.

Douglas Kramon: (13:47)
That was the first Karl Malone game, if I’m correct.

Gabe Larsen : (13:50)
Yeah! Karl Malone, John Stockton. I mean, that was the team. Again we’re a small market company and so [inaudible] every year and –

Douglas Kramon: (13:57)
Was Clyde Drexler on that team possibly? That was a power team.

Gabe Larsen : (14:02)
It was.

Douglas Kramon: (14:02)
It’s the storytelling that you see, it brings it back, the memories. That’s what sports are about. Now, don’t get me wrong. I work in customer care, I’m constantly dealing with things that are issues, broken links, incorrect team logos, pages that are broken that won’t display, let’s say video issues with stutter, jitter, or black screen, et cetera, fantasy confusion. We’re constantly triaging. It never ends. But deep down, when you peel that layer of the onion back, you’re speaking to a fan just like you and they’re more likely to appreciate the conversation and remain an ESPN fan if there is a human element to that.

Gabe Larsen : (14:47)
Yeah. So that would be my followup on that. When you kind of mentioned, and it sounds like you got a decent amount of sophistication in this, you do have some bots, you have some deflection, you’ve got some knowledge base, you’ve got live agents, IVR intelligence on IVR. Without going into extreme detail, how do you kind of find that balance of the individual interaction, but also being efficient and effective and deflecting and making sure that people can self service a little bit? Quick thoughts on that?

Douglas Kramon: (15:19)
So we have tools that determine, based on frequency, recency, frequency, sentiment, and velocity. We know what fans are saying to us via– and I’ll talk on live channels, chat, phone, SMS, right? So those are the ones that we’re doing. Email is not live.

Gabe Larsen : (15:40)
So which one’s most active for you guys?

Douglas Kramon: (15:43)
SMS is growing by leaps and bounds –

Gabe Larsen : (15:45)
Really?

Douglas Kramon: (15:45)
– because the younger demo loves it and we’re finding C-SAT highest on SMS because you move at the pace of the fan. When the fan is texting back and forth with you, they might be doing other things during their day, whether or not in quarantine. They’re moving around and they ask a question. They don’t expect an immediate synchronous response. If they do, our SMS is faster, the agent responds quicker. If not, we see a top C-SAT score with an average response time between three and eight minutes of a response back to a fan, meaning it’s moving at the speed of the fan. So we know the most common questions that are coming into us based on a rapid analysis of keyword extraction rate. And so we immediately put the things up that an FAQ could respond to and put it out there for our bots, our chat bot or SMS bot, our traditional and all of that. But, if you get passed through to an agent and the bot has failed, you immediately move to the top of the queue [inaudible] trying to address. And we then capture, what is that question? And we determine maybe that’s something where we can put that out. [Inaudible] The goal is, if you reach my agent, we have to do what’s called a plus one. Not only do we give you the answer, but we know you didn’t want to reach out to us to begin with. Reaching out to customer service is not fun. We need to make sure that you’re satisfied and that we surprise you with a sports knowledge opportunity, information of an article that might interest you about what we just discussed. So for example, if you’re talking fantasy football and it’s information that now Frank Gore has signed a one year deal with the Jets and you want to understand how you can use Frank Gore, when will he be available in fantasy on the Jets? We will just say details on that and, “by the way, check out this article.” [inaudible] gives details about what Frank Gore’s impact may be on fantasy with the Jets. So always an opportunity just to do a little bit more. Why sports is based on emotion and fans retain that.

Gabe Larsen : (18:13)
Yes. Yeah. I love that. I think, actually, fans do want the self service. For a while, it was a little at a negative connotation, but as a fan, I kind of want to get– if I have those quick answers or quick questions, getting quick answers, I’d prefer to self serve.

Douglas Kramon: (18:29)
Yes. It’s exactly. I think fans prefer self service.

Gabe Larsen : (18:33)
I’m open to chat with somebody and obviously there’s very specific things sometimes where it’s like, look, there’s no bot that can help me with this. I gotta make two transitions from two airlines in two countries. Like I got to talk to someone about this flight, it’s too complicated.

Douglas Kramon: (18:48)
You used to say to our bot, “Agent.” Boom, it goes right to an agent. Our bots don’t take themselves too seriously. They know when to say, “Okay, I’m done.”

Gabe Larsen : (19:00)
Oh, yeah. Well, Doug, we’re coming to the end here. But, you’re my new favorite customer care expert. Loved our conversation. So fun to kind of hear some of the things you guys are doing to react, some of the priorities you’re taking and then just some of the advice you’ve given. And I’d like to end with that. As you think about the audience, other customer care leaders fight the same battles you’re fighting — obviously different brands, different situations, industry, but a lot of the same. We’re all we’re all in quarantine. Let’s see what last piece of advice you’d kind of give to make everybody feel, give them that tip that they can use to win.

Douglas Kramon: (19:35)
That’s a great question. Honestly, you’re not going to have great customer service or fan support as we call it. If this were Disney, we call it like guest support, or viewer support, or whatever it may be. Last year agents were feeling good. Now granted, our agents are now all working at home. They used to work in a center because it’s sports is collaborative and we know that a center is best for that. But when they’re working at home, my recommendation is you have happy agents. You will have happy fans. And it’s a challenge. So we have identified three things. We want to make sure that we have a motivating workspace for our agents. We want to ensure collaboration daily with other agents like you’re in the center. And we have a website where we do constant coffee breaks and we also award agents on a regular basis through what we call nutrition. So it’s workspace, collaboration, and nutrition. Remember these are [inaudible] agents. They’re with their families. So you had a great C-SAT? You’re going to get a family size pizza arriving at your door with a little note from ESPN saying, “Thank you for doing what you are doing.” with the C-SAT review directly below it and letting them know we appreciate them. That means they’re more likely to go to a comfortable workspace that they’ve set up for themselves, that they’re collaborating with others as if they’re in the center and they’re feeling good that we appreciate them. And we’re feeding them where the opportunity presents itself, because these are incredibly challenging times for family and for individuals. Our best is all about making sure we’re keeping our workplace agents happy and it shows in our C-SAT.

Gabe Larsen : (21:18)
I love that, man. Especially the food part. You know, it must be the young person in me. It’s like the food. I mean, it’s something small, but it makes a difference. So I love that idea. I think –

Douglas Kramon: (21:32)
I agree. We have UFC 249 coming up this weekend, which is the first real live sport opportunity — wings for everybody. So we’re excited about this.

Gabe Larsen : (21:42)
Douglas, we are bringing you back, man. I want to hear about that last part. We did not go deep enough into some of the things you’re doing with your employees. So consider yourself tapped again for round two, maybe in the next couple of months, but appreciate you joining. If someone wants to get in touch with you, learn a little bit more about what you’re doing, what’s the best way to do that?

Douglas Kramon: (22:01)
Sure, Linkedin. I’m right on there as Douglas Kramon, K – R – A – M – O – N. I’m happy to chat. I’m always open to learning new things and to sharing.

Gabe Larsen : (22:10)
Love it. Alright well hey, really appreciate your time and for the audience, have a fantastic day.

Douglas Kramon: (22:15)
You too Gabe! Thank you so very much.

Exit Voice: (22:22)
Thank you for listening. Make sure you subscribe to hear more customer service secrets.

 

You Must Know Consumer Expectations to Deliver on Their Demands. We’ve Got the Data.

You Must Know Consumer Expectations to Deliver on Their Demands. We’ve Got the Data. TW

Every consumer has a different expectation as to how they believe they should be treated by organizations they do business with. Perhaps I wouldn’t hesitate to ask for a full refund and an apology when I feel I’ve been wronged, whereas you wouldn’t be caught dead being so demanding.

But while we all have our minute differences, it is also true that consumer expectations generally shift with the times, and have clear generational differences. This past year has brought a significant amount of changes, and businesses may feel more in the dark about what their consumers are demanding. We wanted to pull back that curtain.

Kustomer surveyed over 550 US-based consumers to better understand what they expect from the customer experience, where organizations are falling short, and how expectations have shifted across generations. According to our research, 79% of consumers say customer service is extremely important when deciding where to shop, and many consumers are more picky with where they spend their money than ever before. Read on for the findings from our research, and for strategies to deliver on consumers’ growing demands. You can download the full report here.

We Must Treat Customers as Humans

If 2020 has taught us anything, it is that empathy is of the utmost importance when dealing with customers. As the world has drastically changed, and individuals feel more stress and anxiety than ever before, the potential to brighten someone’s day with a simple support interaction is hugely impactful.

According to our survey, 69% of consumers expect an organization to prioritize their problem if they are upset. Through a combination of sentiment analysis and intelligent routing, your customer service platform should be able to move upset or loyal customers to the front of the line and immediately get them help from the most appropriate agent.

Additionally, 53% of consumers expect a business to know about them and personalize how they interact. To create these meaningful relationships, companies need to adopt technology that allows them to see customer history, issues and behavior in context, no matter the platform. According to Amy Coleman, Director of CX at Lulus.com, the humanity of customer service is often lost in call center environments. “I think that one of the downfalls to old school ticketing systems is that it’s no longer about people. It almost becomes like data entry for those agents that are working on the same thing. It’s how many tickets there are,” said Coleman. “We were never thinking of it in terms of the human beings that are on the receiving end. And I think that’s what Kustomer has really done for us, it’s allowed us to spend the time with the human beings that are on the other line and spend more time developing our team.”

One thing is clear across the board: consumers expect retailers to know how they’ve interacted in the past, what issues they’ve encountered, and they want organizations to actively make amends. A whopping 76% of consumers expect companies to proactively follow-up and reach out to them if there is a problem. Whether it is a winter storm delaying a shipment, a new safety policy, or a fulfillment issue, proactive outreach is not only a nice benefit, it is now an expectation. Proactive communication can provide even more value when you use it for actions like reengaging unhappy or complacent customers, and building brand loyalty with targeted offers. Make sure your platform can power bulk messaging, targeting specific customer segments based on your unique data, like orders, location, or CSAT. In no time your customer service team will turn from a cost center into a profit center.

The Need for Speed in CX

We’ve all been there. Too much to do, too little time. This turn of phrase is even more pertinent for customer service organizations. Delivering real-time service is inherently difficult without endless resources, especially during peak shopping periods. But it is truly what your customers expect.

Seventy-one percent of consumers believe their problem should be solved immediately upon contacting customer service, but 52% report that they’ve experienced hold times longer than fifteen minutes. That’s a massive amount of consumers whose expectations are not being met.

Luckily, thanks to automation and artificial intelligence (AI), businesses now have the opportunity to provide more self-service options, freeing up agent time for complex and proactive support. In fact, 53% of consumers prefer self-service over talking to a company representative, meaning AI-powered experiences fulfill their needs. Tools like chatbots are growing in popularity with both businesses and consumers, with 53% of consumers saying that chatbots improve the customer experience. They can be used to collect initial information, answer simple questions, and direct customers to a help center if human intervention is not needed.

These tools save time for both the customer and agent, and increase the time spent on the actual issue rather than information gathering and low level support. Additionally, 42% of consumers reported that they would be willing to buy a product or service from a chatbot. This transforms AI-powered chatbots from a deflection tool into a revenue generator, with the ability to suggest similar products, or answer questions consumers need clarification on before buying.

To read the full report, including industry and demographic data, click here.

 

Providing a Golden Experience With Jason Henne

Providing a Golden Experience With Jason Henne TW

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In this episode of Customer Service Secrets, Gabe Larsen is joined by Jason Henne, Director of Customer Service at Momentum Solar, to discuss customer service for high-end brands and how to maintain brand reputation in new and existing industries. Jason Henne started his career in CX 26 years ago working for a telecommunications company as a service rep. After moving his way up the company and switching to luxury packaged goods, he has spent the last 15 years at the VP/Director level on customer service for luxury or big ticket products. He and Gabe discuss valuable insights into ideas of tired customer service. Listen to the full podcast below.

Examples, Definitions and Results of White Glove Customer Experience

Gabe and Jason start their conversation off by discussing the definition of white glove customer experience and if it only applies to big ticket customers. Jason notes that while there is a need to make sure that high paying customers get their money’s worth, every customer is valuable. When you work with luxury brands, that expectation is already there. White glove customer service is going above and beyond what the customer expects, even when they are expecting a lot because it is a luxury brand. Jason shares an example of luxury dealership vs any other dealership. He states, “You go into a Lexus dealership, for instance, … you are getting red carpet treatment. “Okay, sir, would you like a bagel? Would you like me to make a cup of coffee for you?” And they keep you updated regularly on your situation and you’ll get a loaner car if you need, you’re not going to get that with the lower end brands.”

How to Uphold Brand Reputation and Recognition

Another important aspect of customer service that Gabe and Jason discuss is the need for positive brand recognition and reputation. Jason is currently working at Momentum Solar, a new industry that typically has a negative connotation. However, his company has done a few things to separate themselves from the negative connotation of their competitors. The first thing they do to build recognition and reputation is educating the customer on the industry, then the company. Jason states, “And then after they’re educated on solar in general, we also want to make sure, obviously as our selling point to let them know the benefits of going with us again, brand reputation, white glove customer service.”

The next thing Jason does with his team to ensure a positive brand reputation is taking every review seriously and getting other departments involved. Solving problems and having the budget to go above and beyond for customers requires department coordination. Positive discussions have to take place with the finance department and the sales team so that they can approve budgets and be aware of any changes made. To summarize, Jason notes, “we’re all working … and coordinating and going into conference rooms and huddle areas and coming up with ideas and talking about issues. … Number one, because we need to make it right for the customer. Number two, if we need to implement a company wide change so this specific issue doesn’t happen again, we need to make that change. So then our sales team can be informed of that change. So they’re educating the customer correctly.”

The Goal of Golden or White Glove CX Experience

As a final piece of advice for companies trying to adjust and improve their customer experience, Jason reminds companies what the goal is for the CX department. He states, “By the time we get them off the phone, let’s have them realize that they are glad that they did call us.” No customer actually wants to call the customer service department to try and get their issue resolved, but it is necessary. Because of this necessity, Jason points out that it is the job of the CX department to make sure that the phone call or interaction with the customer is as effortless as possible and that the customer leaves happy and satisfied. For a final piece of motivation for companies to remember this goal and strive for it, Jason states, “By keeping and making these customers happy, you’re going to keep that positive reputation and you’re going to keep giving them that white glove customer service.”

To learn more about how to adapt your business to the new market, check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode below, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

 

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Full Episode Transcript:

Providing a Golden Experience With Jason Henne

Intro Voice: (00:04)
You’re listening to the Customer Service Secrets Podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen: (00:11)
All right. Welcome everybody to today’s show. We’re excited to get going. We’re going to be talking about two things here. Number one is, how to really drive customer experience with high-end brands. When you’re talking about big ticket items, that real red carpet experience. In addition, we want to navigate through how to manage reputation a little bit in challenging times or in challenging industries. We’ve got such an interesting guest with such a diverse background. We wanted to hit a couple of different topics today. So to do that, we brought on Jason Henne. He’s currently the Director of Customer Service at Momentum Solar. Jason, thanks for joining. How are you?

Jason Henne: (00:51)
I am doing great. Thanks very much for having me today. I really appreciate it.

Gabe Larsen: (00:55)
Yeah. Yeah. It’s always fun to talk to someone who’s got such a — a lot of experience in CX, lot of different roles, et cetera. I think it will be a fun talk track. Can you just double click a little bit on your experience and background and talk a little bit about that?

Jason Henne: (01:10)
Yeah, sure. Sure. First and foremost, I just want to make sure everybody is safe and sound and healthy and doing good and all that, especially in these crazy times, but yeah. So I’ve been in customer service now, this is my 26th year. I started in 1994 in telecommunications as literally a customer service rep on the phones for a telecom company working the 4-40 shift. So I worked 10 hours a day, four days a week, the overnight shift, and then got three days off in a row. And through the years I worked my way up from a call center rep to team lead, to manager, to national account manager, to senior manager. And then I shifted out of telecom into consumer packaged goods on the luxury end where I became a director. And I’ve stayed at the director and VP level now for the past 15 years and anything from, like I said, I started in telecom, but, at least over the past decade or so, I’ve been in what we would consider luxury or big ticket items where you really need to give that white glove and red carpet customer service.

Gabe Larsen: (02:19)
I love that. Yeah, that’s quite the diversified experience. I think it’ll be fun to hear about some of those different experiences. So let’s dive in and maybe we can start with this high end customer service experience; big ticket items, “white glove” as you kind of phrase it as. How do you, if you just kind of for the audience, is it really that much different of motion when you kind of are working for a Porsche versus a Toyota for example. I mean —

Jason Henne: (02:49)
Sure.

Gabe Larsen: (02:49)
Isn’t it customer experience or is it really that much different?

Jason Henne: (02:53)
So you’d like the customer to think that customer experience is customers experience; however, in reality, that really isn’t the case. When you’re working telecom or a cable company or anything like that, they get you on the phone, they get you off the phone. They take care of your problem. That’s it. However, when, just like you said, when you’re talking about Porsche, Cadillac, any luxury brand where they’re spending the money in one big lump sum, whether it’s a finance or a lease or a large purchase, or just sometimes the brand name itself, there’s a reputation that you have to uphold to keep that brand reputation and that brand recognition. So the customers expect that and the customers demand that. So whether it be, I’ll give you an example. When I worked in telecom, we got graded as reps on our average call time. They wanted to keep the calls at, I believe it was, four minutes or less.

Gabe Larsen: (03:57)
Got it.

Jason Henne: (03:58)
I moved on into luxury and I became a leader in the luxury realm. I took call time and threw it out the window. I don’t care if you’re on the phone with a customer for an hour, if you are giving them service that they need at the service that they deserve. And most importantly, resolving their problem, if possible on that one call, that one call resolution. That’s what matters because they’re going to then get off the phone and say, wow, I was really treated great. And then, say they’re at a dinner party or talking to their friends or something and they’re comparing what brands they use or what company they use, that one person could tell the 10 or 15 people that they’re at a dinner party with; “Yeah, well, I’m using X brand and I had an issue with them a few weeks ago and I called them up and wow, they handled everything I needed in an hour and they didn’t rush me. I didn’t feel rushed. And they handled my situation perfectly.”

Gabe Larsen: (04:54)
What I love. And I love that. So it’s a different, there’s certain things you can do in kind of that luxury environment that you probably just can’t really do in kind of that velocity environment, where you’re dealing with hundreds of thousands of transactions and customers.

Jason Henne: (05:11)
Right. And you nailed it when you did the comparison versus Porsche and another type of car. You go in to get your car service and say, you have, I don’t know, a Ugo from like the eighties, if you could find a place that services, and you go and, “All right. Yeah. We’ll take care of it, have a seat.” Well, whatever. You go into a Lexus dealership, for instance, or a Porsche dealership, you are getting red carpet treatment. “Okay, sir, would you like a bagel? Would you like me to make a cup of coffee for you?” And they keep you updated regularly on your situation and you’ll get a loaner car if you need, you’re not going to get that with the lower end brands.

Gabe Larsen: (05:49)
Right.

Jason Henne: (05:50)
So again, it’s brand reputation, it’s word of mouth. And that’s what I take in, in where I am now at Momentum Solar. We are a big ticket item. We really are. It’s not an inexpensive purchase and there are so many benefits to it. And because we know that the customers are spending a good amount of money on their product, if they have an issue with their product or with their contractor, a billing issue, which we have to explain to them, I don’t care how long we’re on the phone with them for. I don’t care if it takes 60, 90 minutes to go over step by step of the agreement or go over their billing with them piece by piece. I want to make sure that when the conversation is done, their situation is resolved, they have peace of mind, and they were wowed by our customer service.

Gabe Larsen: (06:43)
Yeah, I do. I think that’s the right mentality. I love the examples. So one is the phone call, for example, right? Where you kind of ditch the call time and said, “Let’s just focus on whatever we need to focus on to get this right.” And ditch that kind of call time. As you’ve worked with some of your luxury brands in your past, are there other of those types of examples where you did, you kind of got into the specifics of doing it differently, kind of —

Jason Henne: (07:14)
Yeah.

Gabe Larsen: (07:15)
Asked differently, et cetera?

Jason Henne: (07:18)
Yeah, absolutely. I was at, I spent a year as a head of customer service for a very high end interior wall covering company. And my boss who was the chief operations officer, his name is Mike. He was, and what he taught me, and he was so big on integrity. And listen, I’ve always been big on integrity, but they took it to another level and say something wrong happened and you know it was our fault or it was just something that couldn’t be out of everybody’s wheelhouse, right. We knew it was no one’s fault of our own. Maybe it was a shipper or something, but it fell on us and we needed to make it right. Not only do you give the apology, do you make it right, you then, we then went above and beyond. Right. And what I mean by that is, okay, let’s make this more personal. We’re going to send them maybe a bouquet of flowers with an apology note, or we work with a vendor that supplied fudge and brownies for us. So we would send them a box of chocolates with an apology note, or a simple thing such as a balloon or something like that, just to apologize. And I think the integrity and taking accountability of maybe it wasn’t our fault 100%, but we know the onus does fall on us and we’re going to make it right. And we’re going to show you that we’re sorry, and we’re going to show you that we are continually there for you.

Gabe Larsen: (08:50)
Got it. Yeah. So you really did, I mean, you’ve found a way again to just go. It’s almost like in a regular brand, they have these, I say regular brand, but they have these kinds of premier, platinum, the gold, silver, bronze, but it’s like you’re only delivering that gold service, right? Whether it’s a phone call issue resolution. Do you find that, I mean, more companies want to deliver, more companies want to do some of the things you’re talking about. It’s just that it’s too timely and too costly. Right? There’s just gotta be a balance. You just can’t, you can’t do that, you can’t give the bagels to everybody. Right?

Jason Henne: (09:29)
Right, right. You’re right. So, what you have to do is a lot, I don’t want to say begging, but make sure you’re vocal in your finance meetings when you’re talking about your operational expenses, when you’re talking about your capital expenses for the next year. “Hey, Cap X for next year. Okay. On the operational side, we know we might need a few more reps because our call volume, our average call time is still higher. Let’s make sure that we have the Cap X in there for some extra computers for next year. So balance out any additional headcount. Let’s make sure, put your ideas to them, to the finance department when you’re going over your budget for the next year. Make your case, state your case, create a PowerPoint presentation, give reasons why, get surveys from your customers and show them what the customers want. That really does help.

Gabe Larsen: (10:27)
Yeah. Yeah. Do you recommend, I like the planning because I think some people want to deliver that exceptional customer experience, but you mentioned Cap X for example, it’s like, they’re not thinking about the things that need to be in place to do that. Well, you might need some additional headcounts, some different machines, technology, computers, et cetera. Anything else you’ve done double click on that. Like, “Hey, if you’re going to really plan to deliver a great customer experience or go above and beyond a budget people,” anything else you’d highlight in that aspect?

Jason Henne: (10:59)
Yeah, training. You make sure your reps are fully trained on every type of material, product, or service that you’re delivering. So when they’re on the phone with the customer, they don’t have to say, “Ah, I don’t know. Let me find out and call you back.” You want to make sure —

Gabe Larsen: (11:16)
That empowerment, right?

Jason Henne: (11:18)
Yeah. Yeah. And you want to make sure that rep has that knowledge right off the bat. And if it’s a lot to take in, make sure you have a very well rounded and full and easy to navigate knowledge base.

Gabe Larsen: (11:33)
So they can actually get the answers that they potentially want. Right?

Jason Henne: (11:36)
Exactly. And make sure that the knowledge base stays updated because things change constantly and you don’t want to miss anything and tell the customer something from four years ago that might not be applicable now.

Gabe Larsen: (11:48)
Yeah, welcome to everybody’s world. Right? That, that, that darn going, gonna curse. What would you kind of advise? Or, how would you advise clients who are thinking about, I’m forgetting the name I’ve often heard about it, but it’s kind of the tiered customer service program, right? It is that if you’re a gold platinum member, if you’re a high end member, you kind of do go to this and you do get treated differently. Is that, maybe you’ve done that or not done that, but do you think that’s a wise thing to go for? Is it just like, just treat everybody valuable?

Jason Henne: (12:20)
I agree with treating everybody valuable. However, I do understand that companies do tier A, tier B, tier C, depending on the amount of money that a customer —

Gabe Larsen: (12:30)
Yeah.

Jason Henne: (12:31)
Depending on the amount of money that a customer spends either lifetime or through a five-year, four-year or three-year span. However, I think with that, there can become number one, confusion; number two, you then have to make sure your CRM is updated on what level they are; and number three, you then have to

Gabe Larsen: (12:51)
You have three different policies. Don’t you? It’s like–

Jason Henne: (12:54)
Then you have, yes, then you have three different policies and then you have to worry about how do we automatically make sure we know that customer is an, A, B and C when they call. Do you have to put their phone number in your, your call center phone system to make sure they go into this segmented queue? Or does it go into the general queue where they could get everybody and are they first in, first out? There’s a lot of planning in that.

Gabe Larsen: (13:21)
Yeah, yeah. That, that last part, I mean, personalization was before COVID, I think a bigger buzzword. It’s kind of dropped, I think people are talking about a few different things, but yeah, that ability just to do phone lookups and keep the history of all the transactions that somebody has done to really be like, “Hey, I noticed you had a flight in the last couple of months, or you did these purchases.” That’s not a ticketing system. That’s consistent with the CRM system and not all CRMs. So you are sometimes talking about multiple layers of complexity there. Not that, I’m certainly, you’re probably more expert than I am, but I did just want to highlight that because I’ve heard multiple people, we don’t have a CRM, we have a ticketing system. Case management is not CRM.

Jason Henne: (14:09)
Right. That’s such a great point. So I guess to answer your question, I’m not a fan of first class, second class, third class customers. I think everybody should be treated the exact same because that customer that maybe was once a one time purchaser might end up being a multiple time purchaser, giving a ton of referrals if we treat them the same way that we’re going to treat someone who’s spending a hundred thousand dollars on a claim.

Gabe Larsen: (14:36)
Interesting. Interesting. Okay. I want to turn for a minute and attack this, kind of your guys’ space. One of the things that I felt was interesting in your background and actually more in your current prerogative is solar. Solar has, it just has an interesting history, right? It’s had some government stuff, you’ve had some door knocker people. In some cases, in some areas it’s really taken off. In other places, it has a little bit of a bad rap. How have you been able to manage through what let’s maybe call an emerging industry? Something that’s not Telecom. I mean, that’s been around a hundred year. Solar, it’s just got a lot of different players. It’s got a lot of different attitudes, reputations. How does it kind of work managing through some of those intricacies?

Jason Henne: (15:30)
Well, number one, you’re right. Solar has not been around for a long time. It’s still emerging and we’re still getting into more States, as governments are approving it for more tax incentives and that sort of thing. And with that, there have been some negative stigmas because… like you said, people canvassing houses, however, it’s all about proper education and the proper way to go about it. We want to make sure here at Momentum Solar, we want to make sure that every customer is educated correctly and not just on Momentum, but solar in general.

Gabe Larsen: (16:04)
That’s fantastic.

Jason Henne: (16:07)
And then after they’re educated on solar in general, we also want to make sure, obviously as our selling point to let them know the benefits of going with us again, brand reputation, white glove customer service, where multiple climbs on inc 500, our CEO, one in 500 speaks word, um, for CEO of the year for New Jersey. There’s a lot to be said about brand reputation when the industry itself might have a negative stigma about it. We’re not the same solar company as XYZ solar company that might have a million bad reviews. We’re A+ rated on the BBB and we use that. To have it and maintain an A+ rating in the BBB is pretty darn good. And it’s pretty darn important.

Gabe Larsen: (16:57)
And what do you tribute that to? I mean, just double click on that, because that is a big deal. Is that, I mean, you’ve obviously not just, that didn’t come — that took a little work. Right? So [inaudible] I love the education part. So it sounds like you guys focus a lot on education to kind of say, “You know what, let’s sell you on solar first. Let’s talk about Momentum second.” What are some of the other things you’ve done to make sure that you keep that reputation up in the air? That’s impressive. That rating.

Jason Henne: (17:30)
Yeah. So our Better Business Bureau complaints do come directly to my department and we handle them internally. And, because we take such pride in our customer service and we take Better Business Bureau, like I said, is very important. Some companies might not think so, some companies might not care about their grade, but we do. The Better Business Bureau replies, once we go call the customer and try to rectify their issue with them, myself and my management team, it’s either myself or I assign in seminar management. We’re the one that personally writes the replies.

Gabe Larsen: (18:07)
Wow. Wow, cool.

Jason Henne: (18:09)
I don’t want to find that out to anybody.

Gabe Larsen: (18:12)
Yeah.

Jason Henne: (18:13)
I want my department to handle it. We might work with other departments to get the situation resolved because we’re one big team, which is another thing when talking about industry reputation and how to still, how to change that stigma by providing white glove customer service. Constantly, constantly interacting with different departments on a daily basis. When we’re all not working at home, we’re all working in the office and we’re constantly getting up and coordinating and going into conference rooms and huddle areas and coming up with ideas and talking about issues. So every issue is not just, “Hey, look at this, let’s get this done,” it’s, “Hey, we need some time to talk this issue out.” Number one, because we need to make it right for the customer. Number two, if we need to implement a company wide change so this specific issue doesn’t happen again, we need to make that change. So then our sales team can then be informed of that change. So they’re educating the customer correctly.

Gabe Larsen: (19:12)
Nice closed loop process on that. You’re kind of bringing —

Jason Henne: (19:17)
Absolutely. And solar, like I said, solar is not an inexpensive ticket. However, in the long run, it does save you money because of the solar energy that you’re producing and then consuming. So that’s one big piece of education that we have to give the customer. Yes, it might be right.

Gabe Larsen: (19:39)
Maybe that makes tons of sense. So, so number one is you guys have done a lot of education too. It sounds like you’re pretty maniacal about, you’ve identified something like a reputation management tool, like the Better Business Bureau and take it very serious. To the extent of action planning, results, you get feedback, you close that feedback loop fairly quickly, put the change and get it back to the sales team and see if you can do it. Anything else on the mind as you think about your customer service and really trying to drive a different approach in kind of this emerging solar industry that you guys do?

Jason Henne: (20:16)
Yeah. So it goes back to what we were talking about in the beginning with white glove customer service. If you call our customer service number, we don’t have an IVR where you’re saying something and then we’re giving you an answer via AI or anything like that. I want —

Gabe Larsen: (20:34)
You don’t like AI? You’re a human guy, not an AI guy. Huh?

Jason Henne: (20:39)
I absolutely like AI. However, I think for certain price ticket items and certain issues, you need the human touch.

Gabe Larsen: (20:47)
Interesting.

Jason Henne: (20:48)
You need that. You need that human touch. So when a customer or a prospective customer calls, they only have two options in our phone tree, sales and customer service. That’s it. And they’re going to talk to a live person every time. Maybe in the future we’ll implement some AI. If they won’t get there.

Gabe Larsen: (21:10)
You’ve made it available. So yeah, they can basically, there’s no crazy phone tree to go through. You’ve made it simple. It’s quite an effortless experience.

Jason Henne: (21:21)
Right? And the other company I was referring to earlier with our luxury wall covering company that I was the head of customer service for, they don’t even use a phone tree. They, every single call was answered in nine seconds or less live. No prerecording first, press one for this, press two for that, every call was answered live. And if customer service had to transfer that call to a specific person, maybe it was a client asking for somebody in a sales department, we then transferred the call, but there was no recording at all. Every call was answered live in nine seconds or less.

Gabe Larsen: (21:57)
Cool. That’s awesome. I mean, it’s those types of, I just that word of making it easy, right? I mean, the AI is, I think it’s a big thing and in the right time, this word deflection and finding a way of good balance is important, but I like your approach. It’s like where we are right now. Want to make it easy for the customer. Let’s do it. Let’s get it quick and see if we can’t start that process to make sure they’re happening quickly. Jason, I appreciate the talk track. It’s fun. Just to kind of hear about some of your different experiences, again, quite a wealth of experience, both luxury and telecom and now solar. Sounds like there’s some overlap, but definitely sometimes you’ve gone more high end, spent more time, more dollars. Other times you’ve tried to find a bit more of a balance there. As you think about customer service, certainly it’s a challenging time with all that’s going on. What advice would you kind of summarize with, for customer leaders who are trying to figure out how to, and I’ll use a generic term here, but just win, survive, manage all the leads that are coming in, keep the customer service levels high while the satisfaction still is maintained as good. But what would you kind of move in with?

Jason Henne: (23:03)
You know, this is you’re right. This is a really trying time right now. Every customer service department for the most part is working from home and oddly enough, it’s working. Its working. Our service levels are so high right now and our productivity because people aren’t being, I guess, their attention is being kept. What they have to do. They’re not in an office with 300 people. If we need to have meetings, we’re going to zoom it or message or anything like that. Keep remembering that when the customer calls you, they don’t want to call you. It’s a nuisance to them. They’re calling to have a problem taken care of and to give them the peace of mind that they want. So what I can say is what, one thing I tell all my employees is the customer is not wanting to call you. However, by the time we get them off the phone, let’s have them realize that they are glad that they did call us.

Jason Henne: (24:07)
And that’s yeah, that’s the advice I can give.

Gabe Larsen: (24:11)
Yeah. It was like the guys, they’re calling for a problem and that problem needs to be resolved. Let’s not forget the fundamental purpose of customer service. Forget all the times and the numbers. And it’s like, here’s the problem, how do we solve it? Let’s make it easy.

Jason Henne: (24:27)
Yeah. And you know what, let’s make them happy. Let’s make them happy that they did call so they don’t think it was a waste of time. And by doing that and by keeping and making these customers happy, you’re going to keep that positive reputation and you’re going to keep giving them that white glove customer service.

Gabe Larsen: (24:47)
Right. I love it. Well, Jason, again, really appreciated the talk track. Fun to kind of talk through a little bit of these different items. If someone wants to get ahold of you or just continue the conversation, what’s the best way to do that?

Jason Henne: (24:58)
Okay. They could send me a direct email at J H E N N E@momentumsolar.com. M O M E N T U M, solar, S O L A R.com. Or just look me up on LinkedIn, Jason Henne, J A S O N H E N N E. I’ll be more than happy to connect with you and message with you back and forth if you so choose. And yeah, this was a lot of fun.

Gabe Larsen: (25:22)
Yeah. I really appreciate it. We might have to bring you back for round two next quarter, just to continue to kind of chat about what’s what’s the–

Jason Henne: (25:28)
I would love it.

Gabe Larsen: (25:29)
So anyways, man, have a great day. For the audience–

Jason Henne: (25:32)
I would love it.

Gabe Larsen: (25:33)
Take care.

Jason Henne: (25:35)
No problem. Thank you so much for having me on.

Exit Voice: (23:16)
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How to Bring an Intelligent Customer Experience to Your Organization

How to Bring an Intelligent Customer Experience to Your Organization TW

I was beyond excited. I had the perfect gift for my wife for our anniversary planned out. After doing some initial research I had an ad pop up on my Instagram feed that provided exactly what I wanted — a personalized canvas with our wedding song on it. I pictured my wife opening up the package on the day of our anniversary and being overcome with emotion. I was sure that I had “husband of the year” in the bag. Unfortunately, it didn’t work out as I had planned.

The order process for this personalized canvas was very straightforward. I specified how I wanted the canvas to look and provided the exact wording, the canvas size, and the design. It was three weeks until our anniversary so I believed I had plenty of time. I put in the order and they sent me an email that said it would take them 1-2 days to provide me a proof and then 1-2 days to complete the canvas before shipping it. It was exactly what I saw on their website before I ordered. I knew I was cutting things a little tight but wasn’t worried. After four business days, I approved the proof they sent me, I kept waiting to get the confirmation that my order was shipped. After four more days I emailed them on a Friday asking where my order was. I started to freak out as I was down to a week before our anniversary.

I finally heard back from them on the following Monday (as they don’t work on the weekends): “We are a little backed up on our orders. We had more orders come in that we weren’t prepared for “. While they were extremely apologetic in their response they were putting my “husband of the year” award in jeopardy. Two days later I emailed them again asking when my order would be shipped. They responded quickly that it would be shipped the next day and to my relief, it was. It’s too bad that it was shipped on the same day as our anniversary. My wife is very understanding and wasn’t upset. I was disappointed though as this whole situation could have been avoided. Organizations need to consider how they can be more proactive in their approach to the customer experience so they don’t let down their customers and create lifelong customers. This is at the core of becoming an intelligent customer experience (CX) organization.

What Is an Intelligent Customer Experience?

Intelligent CX involves leveraging the technology and data that exists today to create a better overall customer experience. This includes sharing data between the different teams such as marketing and customer service, creating new roles to act on the data, and leveraging new technology such as AI.

Eliminating the Silos

Too often, organizations suffer from a lack of communication between different functions such as marketing, customer service, sales, and manufacturing. The loser in all of this is the customer, and ultimately the business, as companies will lose potential revenue and customers.

Intelligent CX organizations have more open communication and data transparency which creates a more fluid transition between the discovery and buying customer journey stages. As an example, the manufacturing team at the customized canvas company should have informed the marketing and support teams that orders would be delayed. They then should have updated their website and order emails so I would be aware of any delays and sent proactive communication of these delays while I anxiously waited for updates. Instead, I was the one that had to reach out to their customer service team a few times for updates. The friction points that existed in my customer journey could have been avoided by breaking down the silos within this organization.

Use Data to Provide a Differentiated Experience

The second component of an intelligent CX organization is leveraging the data you have about the customer to provide a better customer experience. This was the first canvas that I was purchasing from this company, yet there didn’t seem to be an acknowledgment of that. I felt like any of their other customers. If this data was appropriately used they could have:

  • Proactively reached out when they realized that my order was going to be delayed
  • Routed my issue immediately to the next available agent
  • Provided me with an exclusive and personalized offer as a first-time buyer to help drive repeat business.

We’re seeing organizations with an intelligent CX mindset collect more data at each touchpoint. They are also creating new roles that combine CX and analytics to help deliver on an organizations’ CX vision.

Embedding Artificial Intelligence

The last component of an intelligent CX organization is applying AI to inject automation and machine learning into the customer experience. AI takes advantage of the data that you have and helps organizations act on it in ways that could never be done before. This not only generates additional revenue but can result in significant cost savings.

During the purchase of my customized canvas, AI powered technology could have detected a delay in the processing of my order and proactively sent me an email without having to reach out to the customer service team. Another example is having an AI-powered chatbot on their website that could have provided me with an updated status so I didn’t need to wait until Monday to receive a response. These examples are just a small slice of what AI can do. Smoothing out these areas of the customer journey by leveraging an intelligent CX mindset is what transforms a good customer experience into a great one.

The Time for Intelligent CX Is Now

We need to go beyond providing a great customer experience — customers are expecting more. Intelligent CX organizations break down the silos that exist between different departments, they collect more data and better leverage existing data, and they embed AI into their CX processes. This ultimately creates an extraordinary, frictionless experience for your customers that will result in brand loyalty and ultimately drive a more profitable business.

PS: While it was late, the canvas has a special place in our home and reminds my wife and me of our wonderful wedding.

How to Bring an Intelligent Customer Experience to Your Organization Inline

 

Speakeasy: A Conversation Among CX Leaders

Speakeasy: A Conversation Among CX Leaders TW

We recently held an exclusive invitation-only online Speakeasy with CX executives in California. These leaders ranged from digitally-focused to family-run organizations, across all sizes and industries. The primary purpose of the event was to engage our Kustomer community to discuss complex topics during these difficult times. The conversations naturally flowed from how their businesses are handling the COVID-19 crisis, to transformation while resources are crunched, and finally their top three strategies for success.

What Is Being Done NOW

An executive began by reciting a quote from their CEO: “don’t let a good crisis go to waste.” And boy did that ring true. A key theme that kept surfacing was the importance of unifying product and CX. It’s critical to get buy-in and support from product and engineering around co-owning the CX goals. For instance, you may set a goal for the amount of CS contacts per thousand transactions, and the product team should take this information into account during development.

Several other executives stated that they had a growth problem during the pandemic. Finding the right resources to help the business scale was an issue. Others stated that their CX issues were a mixture of stagnation and scale, and they were seeking to optimize workflows to minimize the impact of furloughs. Regardless of whether the business was scaling or contracting, everyone agreed that baseline tickets were rising and removing friction between product, engineering and support was critical. A great example of this success was raised during the conversation: “How many times have you issued a support request to Netflix?” Most everyone responded: never.

Transformation While Resources Are Crunched

There is an old technology world competing with a new technology world that is now thriving. Is the old technology still relevant? Many organizations are moving towards modern technology and digital transformation.

One executive stated that they were part of the old school class of folks who thought that CX couldn’t be done from home. And yet, they transitioned their CX team to work from home in a week. Interestingly, the CX leader started the process a few weeks before COVID hit as she had a funny feeling. They configured laptops and had them out to agents who previously did not have access to laptops at all.

Another executive stated that their agents, based in London and Austin, already had laptops to successfully work from home, but 200 agents in the US needed monitors to work from multiple screens. Employees came back to the office for basic accessories like chords and power plugs. There was some hesitation about voice quality or even security using home computers, but that went away after the first week. The pandemic accelerated their business continuity plan and now challenges occur more due to kids, school and scheduling.

Many companies saw a surge in volume, so job enrichment and training had to be put on the backburner. They needed more people or more resources to get the job done. However, work from home presented some challenges around measuring metrics and understanding who can sustain remote work and who may not be up to par.

One executive stated, “I think there were people getting away with it at the office and the home office is not conducive to working. Kids are maybe getting in the way. Some folks are struggling and may not be candidates for working from home.”

Luckily, many individuals think technology can help. The CEO of one organization used to work at stodgy banks, and he doesn’t want that for his current company — he wants to be different. He wants to adopt AI and transform into a modern financial institution. Other executives stated that their companies were not as forward-looking on AI, and convincing management could often be a challenge.

Moving the Customer Experience Dial

A CX executive began the conversation by stating that moving the needle 1% is a good thing, and focusing on one single metric that does so could lead to success. In his case, it was support cost as a percentage of revenue. This metric scales because it is clear to everyone.

“If you double the revenue, you can double support costs,” he said. This metric sets a north star and ties every team back to the results. The CX group doesn’t own the code, the product or messaging, but once you touch the customer, you can take what the customer is saying back to the other departments. If a customer tells you a problem, it’s your job to take that problem to the business, and potentially increase revenue as a result.

Organic growth occurs when there is no friction. Look at a disruptive company like Netflix. You never contact Netflix support, and you don’t have friction. Everything slows down if you don’t eliminate friction.

Never Let a Good Crisis Go to Waste

It was overwhelmingly agreed that baseline tickets were rising and that it was important to remove friction between product, engineering and support. In a recent report by Kustomer, How the Pandemic is Affecting Customer Service Organizations, the data mirrors the conversations at the Speakeasy. Our study found that 79% of customer service teams have been significantly impacted by COVID-19, while only 1% reported no change at all. Of the customer service representatives surveyed, 48% observed longer wait times for their customers, 39% reported a lack of resources and 64% said they needed greater efficiencies. According to reports, inquiries are up across phone, email, web and social media channels.

In order to address this, Brad Birnbaum, Kustomer CEO, recommends leveraging technology that can “automate low level support with the help of AI.” This allows a greater number of customers to be served immediately, while freeing up agents to deal with more-complex issues — and 57% of respondents said they were seeing more of these than normal.

To reiterate a comment from one of our CX leaders, “Never let a good crisis go to waste!”

Your Top Ten Takeaways
1. Do a better job of capturing feedback and delivering to the product team
2. Build a strong product team for better customer experience
3. Reduce CX costs by 50% under the notion of do no harm to the business
4. Offer personal value-based services
5. Innovate support solutions like an effortless experience
6. Improve the bottom line AND customer satisfaction
7. Improve knowledge of the product and industry across the company
8. Hire people with industry-specific knowledge
9. Implement self-service as customers want to serve themselves
10. Use all the data you have to make support an effortless experience

 

Achieving a 360-Degree Customer View Isn’t as Tough as You Think

Achieving a 360-Degree Customer View Isn’t as Tough as You Think TW

One of the biggest challenges for contact centers and customer service departments is convoluted systems. According to CCW Digital research, two of the top five areas for improvement include agents spending too much time on low-value work and the absence of a 360-degree customer view.

When customer service agents don’t have a 360-degree customer view, they spend excess time navigating applications and databases trying to manually find customer information and history, which is frustrating and inefficient for both employees and customers. However, with the right technology, it doesn’t have to be that way. Read on to learn why.

Tap Into the Power of a Centralized CRM

Building a 360-degree customer view is dependent upon giving our front-line employees and customer service agents the tools they need to see customer history, route inquiries accordingly, and find solutions seamlessly through an efficient customer relationship management (CRM) platform.

As seen in a recent CCW Digital webinar, during a peak in the pandemic, customer contact volume increased ten fold, while agent capacity decreased 20%, call duration increased 62%, wait times increased by 27 minutes, and as you would guess, customer satisfaction decreased — by roughly 28%.

As customer volume increases and agent capacity decreases, friction is brought into the customer experience, exposing an unforgiving area for improvement in the contact center — the vast majority of CRMs being used are not getting the job done. Simply put, customer service departments around the globe are losing customers as a result of poor management and technology.

Specifically, incorrect and incomplete data means longer wait times, less ability to predict needs, and less ability to personalize interactions.

We’ve seen an uptick in digital channel utilization which means you have more touch points and data sources to aggregate customer history, and therefore a greater need for an omnichannel CRM.

The only way to alleviate the friction in the customer experience is to create a more efficient process, reducing the amount of applications agents need to record and access customer information, and resolve problems by using a single, unified, and actionable customer service CRM.

Increase Efficiency and Personalization Through AI and ML

AI can help you better glean insights from your data at scale. Then it can be used to improve routing and provide agents with real-time guidance and recommendations, thereby increasing their ability to “see” and “use” their 360-degree view.

AI and machine learning (ML) have the ability to improve the precision and speed of service by automating repetitive, manual tasks as well as your most complex business processes. For instance, high-volume conversation traffic could be intelligently routed to the most appropriate agent, loyal customers could be prioritized, and agents can quickly deliver standardized responses when appropriate.

With Robotic Process Automation (RPA), AI can simulate human actions to complete repetitive and rule-based tasks and processes. RPA can allow chatbots to fully complete a customer conversation without the need to escalate to a human agent, as well as provide the customer with more self-service opportunities by tapping into appropriate backend datta. This makes agents more efficient, freeing up their time for complex and proactive support, and gives customers more accurate information quickly.

Let’s take a closer look at chatbots. They are growing in popularity with both businesses and consumers, and can be used to collect initial information, provide responses to simple questions, and even complete standard tasks like initiating a return or answering an order status question. While there is always fear of losing personalization when using AI, ML, or automation, with the right platform, businesses can actually do the opposite.

If a business leverages customer data properly and gives the chatbot a 360-degree customer view, chatbots can ask personalized questions based on an individual’s purchase or browsing history. These interventions save time for both the customer and agent, and increase the time spent on the actual issue rather than information gathering and low-level support. Of course, if needed, once the customer experience requires a transfer to an agent, automation can route the customer to the right agent, best equipped to solve the problem, and transfer all of that data into the agent’s view.

Want to learn more strategies to deliver standout customer service through a 360-degree customer view? Download CCW’s latest report here, filled with insights from Kustomer CEO Brad Birnbaum and NYT bestselling author Shep Hyken.

 

The Top Customer Service Qualities Your Customers Expect

The Top Customer Service Qualities Your Customers Expect TW

Just because your company offers around-the-clock customer service doesn’t necessarily mean you’re offering great service to your customers. Consumers who are attentive enough to reach out for assistance in the first place will always be able to spot the difference between above-and-beyond customer support and disjointed, sloppy service.

Just consider these consumer insights from PwC:

  • 3 in 4 customers identify customer experience as a top consideration in their purchasing decisions.
  • 2 in 3 find excellent customer service more compelling than marketing and advertising.
  • 1 in 2 believes that most brands could improve their customer service.
  • 1 in 3 would break up with a beloved brand after just one negative customer experience.

Certainly, the last thing you want your customers to experience is bad customer service following an already negative experience with your product or service. The type of customer service you deliver should matter to you because it matters to your customers.

But how can you treat your customers right? Well, you can start by exploring our essential customer service qualities list. Not only are the tactics below simply good skills to have for customer service, but they can have a direct impact on your business’s viability. By exhibiting the following customer service skills and qualities, you can help deliver an excellent experience, promote brand loyalty and ensure customer retention.

1. Respect

Great customer service starts with respect for the customer. During each and every customer interaction, it’s important to remember that each customer is a person — not a ticket — and to treat them accordingly. Simple ways to do this include using the customer’s name, thanking them for their patience and keeping your emotions in check, even if the customer starts to get worked up.

Additionally, providing personalized customer service through an omnichannel approach shows that you respect your customers’ time, energy and attention. If your customers find contacting you to be too laborious or time-consuming, you won’t be off to a great start. Instead, make it as easy as possible for them to reach you when they have issues or concerns.

2. Active Listening Skills

Active and effective listening is one of the most important qualities needed for customer service. It requires a deep and insightful understanding of what the customer is saying — and what they’re not saying. Only when you dedicate the time and attention to hearing the customer out completely can you begin to work toward a satisfactory resolution.

Showing that you’re concerned for the customer and attentive to their needs is all part of active listening. Be sure to stay present during all conversations, repeat the customer’s concerns or questions back to them as a confirmation and use the right tools to keep track of the information your customer has already provided.

3. Empathy

To offer the most successful customer service, you’ll need to practice empathy and emotional intelligence. Being empathetic means putting yourself in your customers’ shoes and making an effort to understand the emotions they’re experiencing.

For instance, something as simple as a shipping delay can cause a lot of stress, especially if the customer purchased it for a loved one or a special occasion. And, even if your customer doesn’t articulate any specific emotional dilemma, recognize that their reason for contacting you is partly driven by feelings. In your interactions with the customer, demonstrate that you care about the things they care about and do your best to put their mind at ease without dismissing their concerns.

4. Strong Communication Skills

In addition to the above good customer service traits that relate to listening, it’s equally important to have the right approach when it comes to responding. Exceptional customer service skills include speaking clearly and articulately, providing just the right amount of information and asking the right questions at the right time. Even your choice of the right words and affirming phrases like “can,” “help” and “resolve” can point the customer service interaction toward a more positive conclusion.

5. A Positive Attitude

Speaking of positivity, another important customer service quality is a positive attitude. This, of course, should be paired with an empathetic approach so as to not dismiss your customer’s worries.

A warm, approachable demeanor is always appropriate, and, in the right moments, a dash of humor and a cheerful tone can help ensure customer satisfaction. Even when the going gets tough, a calm and positive outlook can help diffuse negativity and underscore the resolution you’re working toward.

6. Patience

Patience is a virtue — and it’s also one of the most important customer service rep skills, too. For agents tasked with assisting frustrated customers, solving challenging dilemmas and accommodating high volumes of customer service inquiries, patience isn’t always easy.

However, the ability to stay level-headed and attentive enough to follow a customer’s journey and reach a solution helps contribute toward an exceptional customer experience. After all, the last thing a frazzled customer wants to encounter is a customer service professional who loses their temper.

7. Determination

Determination goes hand in hand with patience and related customer care skills like tenacity, persistence and focus. Sometimes, the answer to a customer’s problem is not always obvious or immediate. It takes a determined and focused approach to get to the bottom of some issues, and just as much effort to ensure that things turn out the right way.

8. Product and Service Expertise

Deep knowledge of your products and services — and the confidence to talk about them in detail — are key customer service attributes. When a customer reaches out with a question, they certainly don’t want to end up speaking with someone who is just as clueless as they are. To thrive in customer service, you should know your product or service inside and out. Armed with essential information, you can more successfully and expediently understand your customers’ needs and find the right fixes.

9. Creative Problem-Solving Abilities

Adaptability, flexibility and an outside-the-box approach to customer dilemmas are some of the best skills to have for customer service success, especially when there’s no obvious right answer to the customer’s problem.

When customer service agents can confidently come up with creative solutions on their own, they won’t need to loop in a busy customer service manager for every issue that arises. As a result, customers will feel like they’re in good hands and are sure to appreciate the personalized assistance.

10. Efficiency

Providing efficient customer service is more important than ever. It doesn’t mean you should work through customer support inquiries as quickly as possible, though. Rather, efficiency means minimizing effort and maximizing results.

To do this, take advantage of chatbots and other AI tools to address your customers’ basic needs and gather information so that skilled customer service agents can jump in when their expertise is really needed. Additionally, adopt an omnichannel approach to provide customers and agents with the most streamlined process without repeated information or redundant responses.

Now that you’ve brushed up on the best customer service qualities, request a demo to find out how Kustomer’s CRM platform can help you embrace these critical characteristics and deliver personalized service to each and every customer.

 

Be NICE: How to Drive the Customer Experience with Sergio Frias

Be NICE: How to Drive the Customer Experience with Sergio Frias TW

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In this episode of Customer Service Secrets, Sergio Frias joins Gabe Larsen to discuss the Be NICE platform; a process that companies can use to improve their customer experience. Sergio is an engineer and has spent the last 20 years in the construction, tobacco, and aerospace industries. He worked at Supply Chain for a while, and that’s where his passion for CX started. The company was ranked #13 out of 13 on a customer support survey, and his boss gave him the challenge of rising to the top. By creating the Be NICE program, they became number one. After a brief amount of time away from the industry, he returned knowing that it was where he wanted to spend his time, and he continues to share his passion for the CX industry today. Listen to the full podcast episode below.

What is the NICE Program and What it Stands For

The NICE Program was created by Sergio Frias in order to help give companies the tools they need to have better customer service. It is also an acronym for Nurturing Insights about Customer’s Expectations. Sergio explains, “The whole idea behind that is that for you to deliver a customer enchantments, which is more than satisfaction, which is the wow factor, you have to deliver something that the customer is not expecting. And for you to be able to do that they’re not going to tell you what a wow moment is for them. You have to figure that out. So you have to have an insight.” Customers want to be blown away with quality service and that requires insight. The NICE program helps businesses find these insights and act on them.

The Eight Steps of NICE to Drive CX

To help give companies clear direction, the eight step process was outlined for improving CX. The first step is context, or getting the background information so companies know where they are at and where they want to go. Next is benchmarking. Benchmarking is comparing the customer service tactics of other companies. They do not have to be companies in the same industry, they just need to have good tactics to learn from. Third is the ever important customer journey map. The importance of going through the experience of the customer and mapping it out cannot be forgotten either. And fourth is a step called the “essence of NICE.” Sergio explains, “the idea is that you have to grow the performance from what you are delivering, actually delivering, to what you promised. And then you have to go beyond that because customers are not satisfied by getting what they paid for. … So we have to figure out ways to understand what are the processes that we have to change or make flexible enough so that we can go around them to deliver what the customers are expecting without bankrupting our company.”

The fifth step is about evaluating which processes of the organization or company need to change. It is about not being afraid to take a hard look at a company and figuring out what alterations need to be made and creating a plan to execute those. Step six is called knowledge sharing or making sure that the important information isn’t kept a secret. When knowledge is shared, change can happen. Step seven is making sure that the right employees are in the right places and that they are taken care of. Happy employees help have happy customers. The last step is all about service. To explain this, Sergio comments on the incorrect understanding some people have of what service is. He shares, “So if I serve you, it’s because you’re better than me, which I believe is exactly the opposite because the people who can actually serve the ones that are capable of sacrificing themselves to the benefits of others, those are very special people. … And then we have to make sure that the organization understands that so that the people that will be serving the customers, they will serve thinking that what they’re doing is not just another work like any other work.”

Expert Insights on Where to Start When Improving Customer Experience

To finish up his time with Gabe, Sergio shares some last insights about attitudes and practices companies should have when they start the NICE program. Companies need to have an open mind to new practices and know their brand inside and out. Also, knowing the impact a company has on those around them. Once organizations really know themselves, they will be ready to do the heavy lifting and start making the necessary changes. Another important point he makes is the following; “do not assume that you know what is best for your customers. You have to make sure that they tell you one way or another. You have to deliver something that is aligned with their expectations. What you think is great, really doesn’t matter. What matters for them is what is great for them. So you have to understand what is valued from your customer perspective.” Powerful and positive CX experiences lie ahead for the organizations that learn to apply these principles.

To learn more about the NICE program and Sergio Frias check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

 

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Full Episode Transcript:

Be NICE | How to Drive the Customer Experience with Sergio Frias

Intro Voice: (00:04)
You’re listening to the Customer Service Secrets Podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen: (00:11)
All right. Welcome everybody to today’s episode, we’re excited to get going. We’re going to be talking about how to drive the customer experience using a really interesting framework that was brought to my attention not too long ago. And so we brought on Sergio Frias. He wears multiple hats, actually. He’s currently the President and CEO of the Federation of Canadian-Brazilian Business, as well as he’s also the chief customer experience officer at the Chartered Institute of Marketing Management of Ontario. So Sergio, thanks so much for joining and how are you?

Sergio Frias: (00:44)
I’m fine. Thank you very much for having me. It’s really a great opportunity to be here. Thank you.

Gabe Larsen: (00:50)
Well, I think you bring a lot of wealth of experience in this, obviously in the CX space and I think in the customer space in general. Before we jump into the topic, can you just do a double click real quick? Tell us a little bit more about who you are and what you do?

Sergio Frias: (01:05)
Yeah. Well, I’m an engineer. I worked for construction industry, tobacco industry and aerospace industry for the last 20 plus years. I’m in the aerospace industry. I worked on multiple fronts in Supply Chain in customer support operations, sales, contracts and most recently I decided to change paths in my career and become this CX guide that I am today.

Gabe Larsen: (01:37)
Well, let’s let’s then go further into that. I mean, what was the, what was the thing that made you flip? How’d you become a CX expert?

Sergio Frias: (01:44)
That’s a great question. Actually, for many years, since I joined the aerospace industry, I was being exposed to customer experience all the time. So I had a lot of functions that were to support customers one way or another. So when I was in Supply Chain, I was asked to be the supplier, the purchasing guy for spare parts to provide to customers. Nobody wanted to do that job, but I was asked to do it, I said, “you know what? Nobody wants it, it may be a good opportunity.” I went there, but I was always trying to go back to my usual life. Then at some point the President of the Services Business Units in the company I was working for, he came to me and said, “you know what? I have a problem. We are number 13 out of 13 companies in a survey about good quality service in terms of customer support. We need to be number one. And for that, we need to deliver great customer experience.” And he said, “if you want, the job is yours, you’re going to be the owner of this business. So you buy, you sell, you do everything, all the logistics, distribution, everything.” That was a great opportunity for my career. I was not really thinking about CX, but the more I got into that I realized that I knew how to do it because of the many years working with customers and always being concerned about how to get the customers what they needed. I realized that was an amazing thing, especially when you could deliver and the customers were happy and they — you could see the results right in front of your eyes. And it was a great opportunity because the size of the problem was so big that I had to create something. And I created the NICE Program, which was very successful. Unfortunately, two years down the road, the business unit that I was working for was terminated. And I had to break my organization into three to have a piece of each, each one of these pieces within the other business units in the company. Then I moved to be a sales guy, selling business aircraft. Then I moved to be a sales guy for commercial aircraft, then services to airlines, but I was never the same. After that, my heart was with CX and I was always thinking of ways to get the experience of the customer, either on the sales process or the contracting process or in the delivery process or the aftermarket process, always trying to make it better. And then that’s when I realized that, look, I’m getting old, my friend, if I want to jump on this dream, it has to be now. And that’s what I did. A few months ago I left the aerospace industry. I became an independent guy, and I was invited by the CMO, the Chartered Institute of Marketing Management of Ontario to do exactly what I always wanted; to write my book about the NICE Program and to share the knowledge that I accumulated over many, many years working with customer experience. And I’m still excited about that.

Gabe Larsen: (04:37)
I love it. I love it. I think we share some of that. I also did a lot of selling in my background, but did taste the flavors of CX. And once you go CX, it’s hard to go back. I can relate to that. So, well, let’s dive into this NICE program a little bit. I mean, it sounds — I think the thing that’s always great to come across is when there is a little more structure to delivering customer service, sometimes it gets soft. I’ve talked about that on this podcast before. It’s just feeling. The more you can get strategies and process and structure, I think it all helps us deliver a better customer experience. So start with the why, what is the why of this program?

Sergio Frias: (05:16)
Yeah, if you remember, I just mentioned my boss, he wanted to be number one. And the only way to do that was by delivering great customer experience. So that was the why. The problem is that’s not enough. You have to go lower into how you’re going to actually deliver that. So we came to the how and how we would do that. So we basically had to transform operations, centric organization, or focused organizations into customer centric organizations. That was the only way because the whole organization was focused on running the processes regardless of what the end result was. And we had to convert that. So by basically training people and getting them to be nice on the phone, that was not enough. We had to change the entire organization because otherwise the people with all the good intentions, they would never be able to deliver a great customer experience if the systems behind them, the processes and the tools and everything, they’re not all aligned with the same purpose. So the thought management has to be aligned the processes, the tools, everything has to be aligned. And that brought us to the what, so what we would do. So we basically had to develop the people and we had to upgrade the tools, we had to review the processes and we had to change the culture. So this is what the program is all about, right? So it’s a people and organizational development program, which purpose is to deliver those four things that will actually make the — or materialize the transformation that will end up delivering great customer experience, which let me tell you, at the end of the story already, we became the number one, right? So from number 13, out of 13, we became number one from 13. So that, that’s what it is.

Gabe Larsen: (07:10)
Wow. Do you — I love the alignment when — because you’re right. Sometimes we focus too much on the people side or the process side or the technology side, and you really want to get those threaded together. So they’re all working together. I like that you’ve brought them all kind of in one underlying framework. I’ve got to ask, what does NICE stand for? I mean, is that an acronym? You’ve got to be nice to people as part of this program now.

Sergio Frias: (07:35)
Yeah. Well you do have to be nice to people because that’s the key, right? NICE is actually an acronym. It comes from Nurturing Insights about Customer’s Expectations. The whole idea behind that is that for you to deliver a customer enchantments, which is more than satisfaction, which is the wow factor, you have to deliver something that the customer is not expecting. And for you to be able to do that they’re not going to tell you what a wow moment is for them. You have to figure that out. So you have to have an insight. And for that it’s not magic, right? It’s not fairy dust and suddenly you know everything. It’s a process. You have to build that. And you have to build that through all the interfaces you have with your customer. And in terms of all the customer experiences that they have, that they experienced with your business, starting from the very beginning with what your brand promises, what your marketing says, what your sales process is, how the contracting works, how the delivery works and the aftermarket, and always remember; that if you have customer services, basically because the customer experience failed somewhere before that, right? So the idea is to understand all that, those aspects and how your brand, your company is exposed to the customer, providing experiences, even if you’re not seeing that. And that’s — when you truly understand that, then it’s much easier to be able to take action, prioritize things, and deliver the great experience through all those channels.

Gabe Larsen: (09:12)
I love that. I love that. I think that’s a fun acronym. That’s good to know what that is and again, I liked that you’ve brought them all kind of under one umbrella. Let’s get into some of the components that you find really important as part of this NICE program. How do you break it out? Is it one, phase one, phase two, three pillars, five? How do you think about the NICE overall framework or strategy?

Sergio Frias: (09:38)
Yeah, we basically — it’s a program with eight modules. Yeah. And it’s on purpose because we want to make sure that people understand each one of the phases and each one of the things that have to be done to deliver that great customer experience. The first one is what we call the context. So, for you to be able to go from one point to another, you need to know where you are and where you want to be, where you have to be. And that’s when, when you’re trying to deliver a great customer experience, you need to understand how good is your experience today and how good it has to be based on the strategy of your business. So this is the context. You have to understand exactly what is going to be the trip from where you want to go to where you have to go.

Sergio Frias: (10:22)
Right? The second part is the benchmarking. The second module is the benchmarking. Why? Because there’s a lot of companies out there that are currently, that are delivering an experience as we speak and our customers, they are being exposed to that. So we need to understand who are those companies that are defining our customer’s expectations so that we can have a chance to figure out how to deliver to that expectation. Right? So the benchmarking is a module where we try to understand who are those companies, those companies may or may not be from our industry. Right? So when I was doing this in the aerospace industry, uh, one of the main companies we were looking into was a retailer. The other one was, I guess I can mention the name, it’s McDonald’s right? So McDonald’s, don’t sell spare parts for airplanes, right? I don’t remember to have seen a Mack landing gear, but the fact is those guys, they know very well how to standardize processes and part of our business needed that. So we use them as a reference, as a benchmark, the same with the retailer, they were really good at customer experience. So we did that. And then once we mapped and figured out which companies we could invite to join us in this journey to deliver a great customer experience, we developed a partnership with them and we brought them in to help us to grow, to help us to deliver. Right? The next one is the CX mapping or the customer experience mapping because —

Gabe Larsen: (11:52)
We’ve got context, benchmarking and mapping. Right. Did I get those and [inaudible]?

Sergio Frias: (11:56)
Yes. Perfect.

Gabe Larsen: (11:58)
Alright keep going.

Sergio Frias: (11:58)
Yeah, and the mapping, as I mentioned before, the experience doesn’t start when you actually have a customer on the phone complaining because the product they bought is not working. It starts way before. It starts when, for example, if I say the word Porsche, it defines an expectation already. It has to be something fast, something with great performance and sexy, right? Your brand is already telling a story and your customers are already expecting something out of that brand. And then there’s all the marketing that you do around this name, around this brand. And then you create more expectations and then you start to sell and then you’ll deliver. And then there’s after markets, all the supports after sales, and even the disposition sometimes like you buy a car and when the car is, you can sell it to anybody, you can get rid of it. This is a bad experience. And companies typically don’t see that. So the purpose of this module, you have to map all the expectations that are being created by your organization, your brand, your process, whatever, that you have to figure out a way to deliver to that. Right?

Gabe Larsen: (13:05)
Yeah.

Sergio Frias: (13:06)
And then we have the next module, which we call the essence of NICE. The essence of nice is the following. We, typically the companies that need to do something, it’s because they are delivering a performance that is less than what they sold to their customers. And then the idea is that you have to grow the performance from what you are delivering, actually delivering, to what you promised. And then you have to go beyond that because customers are not satisfied by getting what they paid for. Remember, every time we buy something, we always choose the cheapest one expecting that it will perform like the top of line of that product, right? So customers only are satisfied when they get what they expect. So we have to figure out ways to understand what are the processes that we have to change or make flexible enough so that we can go around them to deliver what the customers are expecting without bankrupting our company. We have to preserve the financial results, but we can do things that are simple, that can deliver satisfaction without breaking the company. And that’s what this is all about. But there’s another level of performance that is the dream of the customer, because some customers — you’re so far from the dream that they’ll not even tell you what the dream is because they don’t think it’s worth, right? So, well, “why would I do that? They’re not even performing the minimum necessary.”

Gabe Larsen: (14:25)
Right.

Sergio Frias: (14:25)
So the idea is to develop your people to a point that they can read in between the lines, they can understand or figure out what has not been verbalized by the customer. So they have to understand what the customers will see as a wow moment, or will see as the magic or see as something spectacular. And when you are able to figure that out and deliver that with those flexible systems, with those flexible processes in your company, you will be delivering great customer experience. So this is the essence of NICE. The next one is a triple away organization. Triple away organization is basically you have to evaluate your entire organization, figure out what are the things that you have to change? What are the processes you have to make flexible? What are the tools you have to improve and everything you have to do to be able to have the entire organization focused on that delivery. And then of course, execute, you know, have plans in place, make those changes and transform your organization.

Gabe Larsen: (15:28)
Okay. So there’s a lot to this, but I think there’s a lot to customer experience. So we’ve got context. We’ve got benchmarking, knowing where you are, where you’re not, I love the mapping, knowing those moments of truth. This essence of nice was different, but I liked those different service levels you talked about. Okay. I think I got that triple organization was number five. What were the last ones? Give me the last three real quick.

Sergio Frias: (15:53)
Yeah. Knowledge sharing because it’s the next one because there’s a lot of knowledge inside of your organization. And you have to make sure that you use that knowledge before you start spending money to get training to 300, 5,000 people. The next one is the right people at the right place. You have mapped the profile of your people and understand what would make them happy. Because as Richard Branson says, “if you treat your employees well, they will treat your customers well.” So you’ve got to make sure that they are happy, because if they’re happy, they produce more, the productivity is higher, the quality is higher, the customers are happier and you make more money. So you’ve got to figure out a way to get them happy. And in this program, we help people to understand how to map those profiles and move people around the organization so that you put them at the right place.

Gabe Larsen: (16:45)
Got it, got it.

Sergio Frias: (16:46)
And the last one is the true meaning of service. This is very important because, particularly in countries like Brazil, where I come from, we come from — we were the last country to abolish slavery. So the whole culture of the country makes people feel like service is something, menial something, subaltern something’s slavish, right? So if I serve you, it’s because you’re better than me, which I believe is exactly the opposite because the people who can actually serve the ones that are capable of sacrificing themselves to the benefits of others, those are very special people. Look at the people that go to the military and go fight a war overseas. Those guys are serving their country. Nelson Mandela, he was serving a cause. A father, a mother that decides to give up the career to stay home and take care of the family they’re serving their families. So those are very special people who —

Gabe Larsen: (17:44)
[inaudible] — cause sometimes.

Sergio Frias: (17:46)
And then we have to make sure that the organization understands that so that the people that will be serving the customers, they will serve thinking that what they’re doing is not just another work like any other work. It’s something really special. And once people realize that they have self fulfillment when they do it, when they succeed and the customers are very happy. And of course the company makes a lot of money. So it’s good for everybody. So that is a very important part of the process.

Gabe Larsen: (18:14)
Oh, I love it. Well, that is a very comprehensive — and I know there’s, as we were talking pre show Sergio, I think you could go on this for hours, but each of those modules, I assume you can go layers deep. But I like that it’s holistic. I liked that it brings people process technology, kind of brings all of those together. As you think about a framework like this and knowing you’ve been a customer experience leader, and you’ve talked to some of those, what would be your kind of tip or advice for people who are trying to start this journey tackling all eight might be difficult [inaudible].

Sergio Frias: (18:50)
Well, first thing is for them not to limit their understanding of customer experience as that moment of truth, the moment you are in front of the customer. You have to look at the overall thing. You have to understand the impact of your brand, of your services, of your products. You have to look at the overall thing, not just one piece. The second would be, you have to change not only the people, but you have to change the organization. If you change either one or the other, I can guarantee you that you’re going to waste time and money. It’s not going to work. You have to change both. The other one would be to not underestimate the power of your organization, the power of the knowledge you have in your organization and the power to make, to promote change. You have to choose the right people to have around you so that the change can actually happen. The next one was do not assume that you know what is best for your customers. You have to make sure that they tell you one way or another. You have to deliver something that is aligned with their expectations. What you think is great, really doesn’t matter. What matters for them is what is great for them. So you have to understand what is valued from your customer perspective. And what I would suggest particularly now is that you understand that improving our processes or trying to find more efficiencies or optimize the way you do things. These days, when people have a lot of capacity, idle, it’s not the best thing to recover from COVID pandemic crisis. Customer experience is probably the best way because that’s when you’re going to bring your customers together, you’re going to be closer to them and you’re going to incentivize the demand to come back. So if I would bet at this point in something to recover, I would bet on customer experience because this is what is going to make the biggest difference over the last few years, I would say.

Gabe Larsen: (20:52)
I love it.

Sergio Frias: (20:52)
That’s what I would say. Yeah.

Gabe Larsen: (20:54)
I mean, times are still challenging for many of us and I think customer service can be that difference, needs to be that difference and I think you outlined a good way for everybody to think through that. So Sergio, really appreciate you jumping on today. If someone wanted to learn a little bit more about you or get in touch with you, what’s the best way to do that?

Sergio Frias: (21:11)
Well, you can find me via my email address is sergio.friasrb@gmail.com. Or you can find me on LinkedIn, my profile, just look for Sergio Frias. It’s me and you can reach me there and we can connect and I can try to help. It will be definitely a pleasure.

Gabe Larsen : (21:33)
Appreciate it. Well, definitely a lot of information gathered today. Hopefully helpful for the audience. Sergio, thanks for joining and for the audience, have a fantastic day.

Sergio Frias: (21:43)
Thank you very much. For you too and thank you for the opportunity. Bye bye.

Exit Voice: (21:53)
Thank you for listening. Make sure you subscribe to hear more customer service secrets.

 

Digital Customer Service: What It Is and Why It Matters

credit card and laptop

In the realm of customer care, there’s tried-and-true, traditional customer service, and then there’s digital customer service. While there’s certainly plenty of overlap, the latter takes a more focused perspective and is designed to support digital consumers by taking their omnichannel customer journey into consideration.

This might have you wondering, what is digital customer service, exactly? And how can digital customer care improve the overall customer experience? Read on for answers to the most common digital customer service questions, plus tips and strategies for delivering a top-notch digital customer experience (DCX), no matter where your customers are.

What Is a Digital Customer?

A digital customer is someone who uses digital channels to connect with businesses, consume branded content and make purchases. These channels include web, mobile, social and email. They can maintain a relationship with a brand without ever setting foot in a brick-and-mortar establishment, but may communicate with brand representatives over live chat, email, text or the phone. Importantly, a digital customer may engage with a company across multiple channels.

What Is Digital Customer Experience?

The digital customer experience (DCX) encompasses all aspects of a customer’s interactions with a brand through digital channels, and the overall brand perception and satisfaction rate they’re left with as a result. This includes touchpoints like:

  • Visiting a website on mobile.
  • Viewing social media ads.
  • Browsing through products online.
  • Reading customer reviews.
  • Logging in to their personal account.
  • Testing out a promo code in the checkout.
  • Completing an online transaction.
  • Receiving an order confirmation email.
  • Connecting with an AI chatbot for assistance.
  • Processing a return online.
  • And every other step along the digital customer journey.

The collection of these activities and impressions, DCX, is also sometimes called digital client experience or digital consumer experience. In most cases, it can also be considered an omnichannel customer experience, given the way in which customers will approach the same brand from various channels.

As a result, another important aspect of DCX is the customer’s experience when switching between channels. For instance, when hopping from a mobile device to a laptop to take a closer look at a product saved in their shopping cart, most online shoppers wouldn’t think twice about the logistical considerations related to making that a seamless experience. But, if siloed systems require the customer to run the same search and provide the same basic information over and over again, the experience probably won’t leave a great lasting impression.

What Is Digital Customer Service?

Customer support has drastically changed over the past two decades to accommodate these somewhat elusive digital consumer behaviors and high customer expectations. Over the next few years, customer service experts predict that ensuring consistency across customer touchpoints will be a top priority for businesses.

But even today, customers look for a rich support experience that efficiently and effectively meets their needs. Simply put, digital customer service, or digital customer care, is what businesses must provide to help meet the needs of their digital customers.

But it’s not just about solving a ticket in a transactional manner; it’s part of a whole new customer engagement philosophy. The best digital customer service approach works toward building and cultivating a great relationship with customers. In this relationship, the brand treats the customer as a real person with a name and a history and a habit of hopping from one digital channel to another.

Additionally, it requires a proactive strategy wherein the business anticipates as many of its customers’ needs and expectations as possible ahead of time — and addresses these with the right infrastructure. Then, when a particular issue arises, the digital customer service team can work toward a personalized solution within an already supportive environment.

How Can Digital Customer Service Improve Your Customer Experience?

To provide successful digital customer service, brands must be able to support customer needs anytime, anywhere. And, the customer should always be able to pick up right where they left off. One-third of consumers agree that the tedious process of having to re-introduce and explain themselves to multiple agents is one of the most frustrating aspects of customer service experiences, according to Hubspot.

However, Accenture found that 91% of customers are more likely to purchase from brands that recognize them by name, remember their purchase history and provide personalized offers and product recommendations. With the right tools in place, brands can deliver the best digital customer experience possible, solve issues as they arise and even provide incentives and suggestions that are tailored to the customer’s interests and past activity. Great digital customer service promotes customer satisfaction and retention.

Moreover, exceptional service can increase customer acquisition through word-of-mouth and reviews. A study from American Express revealed that, on average, U.S. consumers will discuss a negative customer experience with 15 people but would share a good experience with 11 people. The numbers go up to 17 and 15, respectively, for millennial consumers. So, a positive DCX not only stops negative feedback from spreading like wildfire, but it also leaves favorable brand impressions with about a dozen additional consumers for each satisfied customer.

How Can You Provide Excellent Digital Customer Service?

In order to provide seamless digital customer service and a seamless DCX, you’ll need to direct your efforts toward digital customer experience management. Let’s explore a few best practices to work into your strategy.

First, take advantage of automation, AI and self-service tools that can quickly collect data and diagnose problems. When a customer need arises, these tools can allow customers to access immediate information — and potentially a quick solution. Or, they can collect the most important details and open a customer support conversation. The best tools will be able to manage or assign conversations and even deliver automated messages based on certain triggers you’ve identified, saving you time and energy to address more complex customer needs.

Next, make sure you’re set up with a system that stores and transfers customer data to support more seamless customer care. For instance, a skilled customer service agent who is prepared with the background information gathered by a chatbot can get right to work solving more complex issues. The customer service team will appear more capable and expedient when they don’t have to backtrack. Plus, customers have come to expect customer service handoffs that are as seamless as their digital browsing and buying experiences.

Finally, remember to gather customer feedback on the support and overall DCX you’re providing after each digital customer interaction. When customers have a chance to offer their opinions, they typically feel more satisfied with the interaction overall. Plus, you can use customers’ valuable feedback to improve your processes.

Does Your Digital Customer Service Strategy Deliver?

Our tools equip some of the best digital customer experience companies and most beloved brands out there. Request a Kustomer demo to find out how.
 

How to Create a Rockstar Customer Experience with James Dodkins

How to Create a Rockstar Customer Experience with James Dodkins TW

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In this episode of Customer Service Secrets, Gabe Larsen is joined by James Dodkins to explore a new way of creating a powerful customer experience. With a unique background, James has made himself into a prominent figure in the customer service world. James started his career as a professional rockstar. At the end of his music career, he decided to go into insurance and explore more conventional jobs. Eventually, he found that he could combine principles from performance and showmanship to customer service. Motivated by the quote by Jerry Garcia, “Don’t be the best in the world at what you do, be the only person in the world that does what you do,” he has helped others create a rockstar customer experience. Incorporating music into his keynote speeches, he inspires people all over the world and shares some of his valuable insights with Gabe. Listen to the full podcast episode below.

4 Step Framework to Proactive Experience Recovery

Proactive experience recovery, or PXR, is the practice of fixing a problem during the crisis or before it happens. Noticing issues and making changes before a complaint comes in is essential because, as James shares, only 4% of dissatisfied customers will complain. When it comes to having a rockstar experience, waiting for a complaint isn’t good enough. To counteract this, James shares a four-step framework for having good PXR. He states, “So the four-step framework … is identify, monitor, communicate, compensate.” Identify the problem, monitor the problem during the experience, communicate to the customers that you know something is wrong even if they aren’t aware, and compensate for errors. James also states that most companies only do the first two steps. To have a significant edge when it comes to PXR, companies need to accomplish all 4 steps.

The Role of Compensation in PXR

The principle of compensation or the need to compensate for errors in business is something that isn’t always executed correctly. As mentioned above, a lot of unhappy customers don’t say anything to the company. Because of this, companies that compensate for errors before being asked have a significant edge upon competitors. James quotes, “And it doesn’t have to be a monetary compensation, but some sort of gesture goes a long way towards changing how a person feels about a particular situation, only when they don’t have to ask for it. It’s when it’s a voluntary gesture.” The only way that compensation becomes a proactive gesture is if businesses are on top of the data and experiences that their customers are having.

Old Philosophies and the Need to Evolve

The way that businesses are organized also poses a problem to rockstar customer experience. James quotes Adam Smith, an important historical philosopher, and his work, The Wealth of Nations, to illustrate how businesses are organized. Adam Smith brought about the division of labor and the idea of the assembly line. Businesses were organized according to skill instead of focusing on the overall outcome. James notes that companies today are still being influenced by ideas from 1776. He states, “People started doing that and in the manufacturing world, when they were making stuff, it worked really, really well. But of course, things have evolved. Things are different. We are now more of a service economy than a manufacturing economy. When you try and apply a manufacturing mindset to service experiences, it just doesn’t really work.”

There is a drastic need to change business organization ideology to more of a service experience mindset. James also suggests that in order to bring about this change, team structure needs to evolve to be more like a soccer team. The goal is to win the game, not highlight certain players. Instead of paying people based on high performance in a specific skill, businesses need to put the successful customer experience first. James states, “We need to understand who the customer is, what their successful outcome is, how are we going to measure the delivery of it, and then put teams together, different skills and different core competencies who are best suited to deliver that success. Don’t organize by skill set, organized by ability to deliver customer success.” If businesses start to evolve how their teams are organized, a rockstar experience and an edge on competitors will shortly follow.

To learn more about creating a rockstar customer experience, check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

 

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How to Create a Rockstar Customer Experience with James Dodkins

Intro Voice: (00:04)
You’re listening to the Customer Service Secrets Podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen: (00:11)
All right. Welcome everybody to today’s show. Today, we’re going to be talking about rockstar customer experience. I think this will be an interesting one. To do that, we brought on James Dodkins. James has got an interesting background. Now, he actually was a legitimate, real life award winning rock star playing heavy metal, released albums, jumped on stages and he uses all of this unique experience to really energize and power drive that customer experience in this idea of customer experience rockstar for his clients. So, he currently runs his own show. It’s called Founder and Customer Experience Rockstar CX. So James, really appreciate you jumping on and how are you?

James Dodkins: (00:55)
I’m very good. Thank you. Thank you for having me.Thank you for inviting me on.

Gabe Larsen: (00:57)
Yeah. As we were talking pre-show, customer experience sometimes can have, I don’t want to say it’s fluffy, but it can be a little boring at times. Certainly, I think you bring a slightly different perspective to it. And so I’m excited to get into that today. Can you fill in any blanks? Tell us a little about yourself and kind of maybe your background from what I missed.

James Dodkins: (01:22)
Well, I mean, you kind of covered it all, but yes, I used to be an actual real life, legitimate award winning rockstar, but now I’m not. Now I just pretend to be a rockstar. So I released albums, toured the world, had videos on TV, was in magazines. And when that all came to an end, I did the next logical thing after being an international rock god and I joined an insurance company. And I never used to tell anybody that I had a music career because it came with baggage and I thought people would have preconceived notion. I mean, they would be probably correct preconceived notions, but I just didn’t want them to have it. So I wear my way through my corporate career, no one knowing that I used to be a rock god, but then I got really bored because I was having to pretend to be someone that I wasn’t, you know, suit and tie, briefcase, being really careful what I said, to who I said, and how I said it and how I behaved and how I presented myself. And essentially I’d created this corporate version of myself. It just wasn’t me. And it was making me miserable. Lots of things sort of converged and it hit me all at once. There was a quote from a guy called Jerry Garcia from Grateful Dead. You heard of it?

Gabe Larsen: (02:33)
Oh yeah, definitely. I mean, I can’t say I’m a huge fan, but I know the band. Absolutely.

James Dodkins: (02:39)
Well, nor am I. I think that music’s kind of crap but the quote is good and it’s one that’s changed my life and who knows, maybe it may change some of your listeners’ lives too. And the quote is “Don’t be the best in the world at what you do, be the only person in the world that does what you do.” And I was like, woah. I realized all of a sudden, I’ve got this really cool past that when people did find out about it, they were fascinated by it. They wanted to know more, they thought it was really cool. I’m trying to do this thing in the world where I’m trying to increase the knowledge of customer experience and the effectiveness of customer experience and trying to spread it around the world. Why not see if I can put these two things together to help amplify, for want of a better word, that message and spread it out there. And I’m quite embarrassed. I didn’t realize it earlier, but there are so many parallels between putting on a good show to your fans and delivering a good customer experience to your customers. And literally from that point forward, I haven’t looked back. And the nice thing is about it is I don’t have to pretend to be anybody other than who I am. I’m just me being my authentic self. The dumb thing is as well, I said to my wife, I’ve got this idea, I’m going to change the company. I’m going to take us into the 21st century, I’m going to revolutionize what we’re doing. She’s like, “Oh this is exciting, Tell me.” I was like, “I’m just going to be myself.” She was like, “Eh, I don’t really like you being yourself around the house. I don’t think people are going to give you money for that.” But she was wrong.

James Dodkins: (04:14)
And here we are today.

Gabe Larsen: (04:16)
No kidding. Big change.

James Dodkins: (04:19)
So, I hit the road. I wrote a musical keynote talk, which is called “Rules for Rockstars,” which works in any industry because any industry can improve by delivering rockstar customer experiences, I play guitar in the talk, there’s tour stories and musical examples, and people seem to like it. So I’m having a great time right now.

Gabe Larsen: (04:39)
I love it and I know there’s other content that you do out there, but the live rock star keynote sounds like that might be fun to check out. So, let’s get into this idea of rockstar customer experience. Maybe you can elaborate a little bit on some of the key principles that you’ve found to really drive that “rockstar experience” that you’re talking about. Maybe start at the top.

James Dodkins: (05:02)
Well, I mean, there is no top really because for every company and in every unique situation, there would be a first place to start. But there’s various concepts that people — we try and explain and try and get people to think about when it comes to delivering a rockstar customer experience. And one of them, which we were talking about beforehand, which is proactive experience recovery or PXR. And this is the idea and practice of not waiting for complaints. It’s the practice of fixing an experience in the experience. So if I — let me give you the old sort of — I don’t know if it’s an analogy or a simile or it’s essentially a story that will put this into perspective. Let’s say that you’re in a bar, you’re walking through the bar and you walk past the person and they’re carrying four bottles of beer and you bump into them and they spill the beers. Okay. That’s the scenario. There are four ways in which you can go about dealing with that situation. And number one, which is what most companies would do in this situation is they would run away to the other side of the bar and hope that the person never comes after them.

Gabe Larsen: (06:15)
Yeah. Yeah.

James Dodkins: (06:15)
So they’d run off and hope they never have to deal with that conversation.

Gabe Larsen: (06:19)
True, true.

James Dodkins: (06:19)
The problem is the majority of the time, the person won’t come after them. And then the person’s in the corner of the bar going “I got away with it.” The problem is that person’s now telling everyone else in the bar what jerk you are. So that really does start to affect first impressions. And remember that one customer’s bad experience can quickly become thousands of potential customers, bad first impression. And number two, you run away. But that person does come after you and that person taps you on the shoulder, but then you turn around and go; “Actually, when you entered the bar, you agreed to a set of terms and conditions whereby if the bar was over an 80% occupancy rate, bear spillage was a possibility. And either way, you were carrying over the recommended load limit of beers, therefore any drink replacement liability falls on your shoulders. Thank you, bye.”

Gabe Larsen: (07:05)
That’s totally true.

James Dodkins: (07:09)
So you basically read them the terms and conditions.

Gabe Larsen: (07:10)
Yeah aw man. I’ve heard those terms and conditions before. Screw you, right?

James Dodkins: (07:16)
Well, now the guy really thinks you’re a jerk and might threaten to punch you in the face. Number three, after the guy has threatened to punch you in the face, you turn around and go, “Yeah, sorry. I was only — Yeah, of course. Of course. I’ll replace the beers. Of course I’ll replace the beers.” And he still thinks you’re a jerk because you didn’t offer to do it in the first place and he had to threaten to punch you in the face to do it. Now, that is what most companies get to when the customer kicks up enough of a fuss that you think are the business equivalent of being punched in the face. You go, “Oh, okay. Right. We’ll put it right. We’ll give you a gift basket or a voucher or something just please go away and stop talking to us.”

James Dodkins: (07:53)
Or, number four, the way we would all most likely act in real life but least slightly acting in the business world is we would immediately turn around, we would immediately apologize and we would immediately offer to replace the beers without the person having to ask. I think we need to take that mindset in business a lot more. We need to be understanding the things that cause dissatisfaction in our experiences. We need to be monitoring the experiences to notice when these things happen. We need to be communicating to the customers when these things happen that we know something has gone wrong and then we need to be putting it right. So there’s a little framework for that. Do you want to hear the little framework?

Gabe Larsen: (08:27)
Please, please, because I think this setup is awesome. Right? It kind of — that’s something, you’re right, we can all relate to. Right? We spill a drink, we’re in a bar. It’s funny, sometimes those things make so much more sense, but when we put it in business, it’s like, we just can’t replicate it. So yeah. Give us the framework of how you can think through that.

James Dodkins: (08:44)
Yeah. Well, I mean, that’s a bit of a side. That is the large majority of the work I do is coming up with stupid stories that highlight business things that make you go, “Ah!” Because in the scientific world, I’m what’s known as an idiot. So in order to understand quite complex concepts, you sometimes need to distill them down into like the simplest method of understanding possible and use stories. So, in my quest for trying to, in a vain attempt to understand these complex business issues, I’ve managed to come up with some cool little stories that help other people understand it too. But anyway, so the four step framework for only four steps, only four, is identify, monitor, communicate, compensate. You want to spend some time to identify the things in your experiences that cause dissatisfaction. You probably already got the data for this. You probably don’t really need to do very much legwork with that. So identify the things that essentially piss your customers off. Then monitor the experience in the experience, while it’s happening, during the experience. Not afterwards, but during the experience to notice when these things happen.

Gabe Larsen: (10:01)
Okay. Okay.

James Dodkins: (10:02)
When you’ve noticed something has happened, it’s not good enough just to go, ” Oh, we’ve noticed something has happened.” You need to actually act on it. You need to proactively communicate to the customer to let them know that you know something has gone wrong. And many times this will be before the customer even knows something has gone wrong.

Gabe Larsen: (10:18)
Yeah. Yeah.

James Dodkins: (10:20)
Sometimes you’re letting them know something has gone wrong that maybe they wouldn’t have even noticed who knows, but you’re doing the right thing. So you are proactively communicating to them, saying, “look, this thing has gone wrong. We know it has gone wrong and we’re running and we’re fixing.” And then, compensate. So put it right. And it doesn’t have to be a monetary compensation, but some sort of gesture goes a long way towards changing how a person feels about a particular situation, only when they don’t have to ask for it. It’s when it’s a voluntary gesture. When you’re saying, “Hey, look, I know this thing has happened. We’ve noticed this thing has happened. Don’t worry about it. We’re on it and as an apology, we’ve credited your account with X.” The deal with this is, joking aside, only 4% of dissatisfied customers will complain. And the larger majority of the rest will vote with their feet. They’ll just leave and go somewhere else. If you are only fixing problems for the 4% of people that complain you are missing a massive opportunity. So that is the essential concept of PXR, proactive experience.

Gabe Larsen: (11:23)
I like the four steps. Where do you feel like people go — I mean, you’ve talked to people a lot. Is it the identify? Is it the compensate? Where do they typically go awry on this? Is there certain places or is it just all the steps are a little difficult for companies to kind of jump onto?

James Dodkins: (11:40)
So the first two, a lot of companies already do. Okay. But it’s for the wrong reason. And they don’t take that next step. A Telco company will see that they’re not getting any coverage in a certain place, or a train company will know that their trains are going to be late or an airline will know they’re going to land late. So they monitor it and they know it’s happened. Some will communicate, but some will just sit on it. They’ll just kind of wait for the complaint. They’re like, “Well, look, if people don’t complain, then we’ll have no problem.” And that’s shortsighted at the end of the day, because like understanding that 96% of people that are dissatisfied, won’t actually complain; only taking the 4% that do complain as everyone that’s dissatisfied because surely if they were dissatisfied, they would complain. That’s a stupid way to look at it. And so a lot of companies they’ll know something has gone wrong, but they don’t want to reach out whether it’s, they’re scared of the backlash, whether they don’t want to spend the money, whether — there’s various reasons. The first two, a lot of companies already do. It’s the last two where people stumble.

Gabe Larsen: (12:56)
Yeah. Fascinating. It’s probably right. Right? I mean, a lot of people that can fix the — they can find the problem, but actually doing something about it gets a little more difficult. Okay. So I like this idea of proactive experience recovery. Got it. Four steps, PXR. Another thing you and I talked a little bit about was this idea of this team structure, like teams are not often aligned or able to — they’re not in a structure that actually enables them to be successful. Can you elaborate a little bit on that? What, what does that mean and how do you kind of go about that?

James Dodkins: (13:24)
Yeah I do. Well, I mean, this is quite a — we’re going to get deep now. So if you think of any organization in the 21st century and you think of that org chart or the fancy word OrganiGram. What shape is it?

Gabe Larsen: (13:41)
It’s always, well let’s see. It’s usually diagram. It’s higher — It’s, what is it? It’s top down.

James Dodkins: (13:47)
The CEO at the top.

Gabe Larsen: (13:49)
Top down, kind of scrolls down. What shape is that? Some sort of a top down diagram.

James Dodkins: (13:56)
It’s a triangle, essentially.

Gabe Larsen: (13:57)
That’s right. It’s a triangle. Yeah. Fair point. Yep. You got it.

James Dodkins: (14:00)
So you’ve got the CEO at the top all the way down to the lowly minions at the bottom.

Gabe Larsen: (14:05)
Yeah the losers at the bottom.

James Dodkins: (14:06)
The losers. We organize our businesses around that, that’s what we use. That’s our blueprint for how we run our business. Now, where that came from, that’s an interesting story. So there’s a guy called Adam Smith. He’s actually on the back of our British 20 pound notes. He went into a pin factory in Scotland. And when I say pin factory, that literally is what they made. They made pins for tailoring. And he was looking at what they would — he was, he was an economist. He was a social economist. And he was looking at how they did work. And he realized that their output was largely dependent on who was working on any given day and how skilled those particular individuals were. So one day you get loads of really good pin makers in. They made loads of pins. Other days you get some really crappy pin makers and you’d make hardly any pins. And he thought, wouldn’t it be a really cool idea rather than doing it this way, we actually split up the process of making the pin, train people very well to just do one part of that process and then they just get very good at doing that and see what that does. And that was the division of labor. And he wrote about it in a book called Wealth of Nations. So supposedly he increased output by 24000% by doing that. By getting a person to say, “look, your only job now is sharpening pins. Your only job now is packaging pins. Your only job now is a wire extruder”. I don’t really know all the steps of making the pins.

Gabe Larsen: (15:35)
You fooled me.

James Dodkins: (15:39)
Well, thank you. Trained everybody up just to do one specific part of the process really, really well. Don’t ask any questions about anything else you don’t need to know about anything else. All you need to do is do this one thing over and over and over again, really, really well. This was a massive departure away from traditional craftsmanship where let’s say, I don’t know, you’re making a chair that the woodsmen, the carpenter would find a tree, cut down the tree, take the tree back to the workshop, do all the things you need to do to a tree to turn it into a chair, sell the chair, service it. They would do everything. They would own the process and the experience from start to finish. And this was like the opposite of that. This was a case of the person that was sharpening the pin had no idea what else was going on because they didn’t need to. And then of course you had departments form around this. And then you had the CEO at the top. It was like the chief pin maker, the person who knew the most about making pins and they made all the really important decisions. And that essentially created the organigram, the business chart that we use today, that pyramid.

Gabe Larsen: (16:44)
Okay.

James Dodkins: (16:44)
But the thing is he wrote about it in Wealth of Nations. Do you know when that was published? It’s a long shot. You probably don’t.

Gabe Larsen: (16:51)
1620?

James Dodkins: (16:55)
1776.

Gabe Larsen: (16:55)
Was it?

James Dodkins: (16:57)
Yeah, so I’m not a mathematician, but that’s a long time ago. And we are still modeling our businesses today on a pin factory from Scotland back in the day. And supposedly, it was even mentioned in the declaration of independence as cited as their model for economic growth because he did pretty well. People started doing that and in the manufacturing world, when they were making stuff, it worked really, really well. But of course, things have evolved. Things are different. We are now more of a service economy than a manufacturing economy. When you try and apply a manufacturing mindset to service experiences, it just doesn’t really work. So the problem with this is it’s created an environment and a culture where the majority of people think that the customer is not their job because they look at this chart and they say, “Well, I’m nowhere near the customer.” I mean, the customer is not even on the chart, which is, that’s another conversation for another day. But they say, “Well, I’m nowhere near customer services or any customer facing things. The customer’s not my job.” We’ve created this. The thing is this chart doesn’t exist. It’s not real. It’s just a drawing on a piece of paper. It’s a collective hallucination. We’re all just agreeing it exists, but it doesn’t. If we start thinking about it, it wouldn’t exist. So every single piece of work you’ve ever done, every single software you’ve ever used, every single project you’ve ever run, every single solution you’ve ever implemented has been based on a blueprint that doesn’t exist. That’s not real. This is like the red pill moment in the matrix. I should have warned you, but it doesn’t exist. The only reason we think that way is because of the way we draw the charts. I think we need to draw the chart in a different way. I think we need to think more like a soccer team or if you want to use the correct word football. So I’m talking about, you know, the football you play with your feet.

Gabe Larsen: (18:49)
Right, right, right, right.

James Dodkins: (18:50)
So I think we need to think like a football team. And so there’s three basic questions you’ve got to ask when you start thinking like that. Who is the customer? So for a football team, soccer team, who is the customer?

Gabe Larsen: (19:03)
It’s probably the fans right? I mean, it’s the fans, isn’t it?

James Dodkins: (19:07)
Yeah the fans. So they come and watch the team play. So the experience of watching the team play, what is their successful outcome from that experience?

Gabe Larsen: (19:16)
Okay. Okay.

James Dodkins: (19:17)
See the team win.

Gabe Larsen: (19:18)
Yeah. Okay.

James Dodkins: (19:19)
So win the game. And then the next question is, well, what do we need to measure to know whether we’ve delivered that success or not? And it’s simple, the score. So you understand, okay, this is who my customer is, this is a successful outcome, and this is how we’re going to measure the delivery of that successful outcome. Now, as a bit of an aside, you can measure many things in a football game. You can measure how many passes, how many tackles, how many yards run, how many corners, how many throw ins, anything, all right. But no analysis of that data would ever tell you whether you’ve delivered that customer success or not. The only thing that would tell you whether you’ve delivered customer successes is in the analysis of the score. It’s like a lot less when it comes to metrics, but it’s a lot more meaningful. But anyway, so, okay, we understand this now. We understand this is what we need to achieve. It’s the manager’s job in a football team to put a team together with different skills and different core competencies; strikers, midfielders, defenders, who are best suited to deliver that success, who are best suited to win the game. We don’t do that in business. We don’t say who’s the customer, what’s the successful outcome. How are we going to measure it? Okay. Let’s put a team together with different skills and different core competencies who are best to deliver that successful outcome, who are best to deliver this experience. We put all of the defenders out. We put all of the goalkeepers out. We put all of the strikers out. If you were watching a soccer game and the manager put just 11 defenders on the field, you’d be like, “hang on a second. What? That doesn’t even make any sense.” But that’s what we do in business because we’re not focusing on the successful customer outcome. We’re focusing on charts. We’re focusing on what’s easiest for us to manage rather than what is most successful for the customer.

James Dodkins: (21:07)
And the thing is we will then target people for the success of their departments rather than for the success of the customer. So imagine, right, in a football team, their target is to win the game. Yes, they have lots of other things that they have to do, and they have different skills and different core competencies. But overall, they work together as a team to win the game. But imagine if I said, okay, defenders, you’re going to get paid based on how many tackles you make. Chances are what they would do is pass the ball to the opposition strikers, to give them the best chance of getting more tackles. Well, that’s not aligned towards delivery of success. If I said to the midfielders, you’re going to get paid for how many passes you make. They’d just stand in a circle and pass to each other.

James Dodkins: (21:47)
Well, that’s not aligned to the customer’s success. Strikers, if we said to the strikers, “Hey guys, you’re going to get paid on how many shots you take.” No matter where they were on the field, as soon as they got the ball, they’d take a shot. That’s not aligned towards that delivery of customer success. What we do is we get these people together and say “Yes, there are different things you have to do, but the ultimate goal is to win the game.” We need to do that in business. We need to understand who the customer is, what their successful outcome is, how are we going to measure the delivery of it, and then put teams together, different skills and different core competencies who are best suited to deliver that success. Don’t organize by skill set, organized by ability to deliver customer success. Sorry I ranted for a little there but [inaudible].

Gabe Larsen: (22:28)
No, you’re fine. I mean, I think that’s, I think you hit a couple of real powerful points, right? I mean, the Adam Smith thing is fascinating. But whatever it is, I mean, ultimately we’ve been focusing on stuff that is not customer driven. It’s skills driven or cost driven or structure driven. And then we question why that structure doesn’t deliver the outcomes we want. Well, we didn’t organize it that way. We didn’t define the outcomes and then build around that. And so, wow. That one may take, to really build and design a function around customer experience rather than traditional concepts of structure and org charts and things like that. I don’t think we’re ready for that, man. I mean, that would take some time. I mean, there’s some modern companies who have really, I think, built their whole company around the customer experience. There’s some older companies like Disney, it’s all about that journey. But, you’re right a lot of us are probably still operating in 1776. Interesting. Well, James, it sounds like there’s probably another thousand things we could talk about, but let’s wrap for the moment we might have to bring you back on. In summary as you think about “rockstar experience,” what would you leave for the group as people try to kind of up-level themselves and get a little bit more proud, a little better in what they do as far as delivering that type of quote unquote “rockstar experience?”

James Dodkins: (23:56)
Well, again, I’d just say step back from what you’re doing, try and understand who your customers are at a psychographic level not a demographic level. Care more about who someone is than what someone is, understand what their successful outcome is, understand how you’re going to measure the delivery of it, and then align everything you’re doing towards the delivery of these successful outcomes for your customers at a simple level. If you can start doing that, you’re going to be miles ahead of your competitors.

Gabe Larsen: (24:20)
Yeah. Yeah. Amen man. Amen. If someone wants to get a hold of you, learn a little bit more about rockstar customer experience, where do they go?

James Dodkins: (24:27)
Go to Jamesdodkins.com. J-A-M-E-S D-O-D-K-I-N-S.com. That’s weird, I never usually have to spell my first name. It’s usually, like when you’re on the phone, like signing up for something, you gotta spell your last name. I don’t usually have to spell my first —

Gabe Larsen: (24:45)
Yeah, James Dodkins.

James Dodkins: (24:46)
[inaudible] J A M E S D O D K I N S.com. Go there, you can find out some information about my musical keynote. If you’ve got an event coming up that you would like to be unforgettable, then hit me up.

Gabe Larsen: (24:58)
I love it and we’ll make sure we put that in the show notes. So James, thanks again for joining. For the audience, I hope you have a fantastic day.

James Dodkins: (25:06)
You too, my dude. Thank you for having me.

Gabe Larsen: (25:09)
Yep.

Exit Voice: (25:18)
Thank you for listening. Make sure you subscribe to hear more customer service secrets.

 

Everything CX Leaders Need to Know About Customer Satisfaction Metrics

woman on phone

Customer service leaders have a lot of data to track and interpret, with customer service satisfaction metrics as some of the most important. But these satisfaction metrics aren’t just for evaluating the efficacy of support agents. They also correlate strongly to customer loyalty and can help inform business decisions across various departments.

We’re covering some of the most frequently asked questions our CX team receives about the most valuable customer satisfaction metrics and the best customer service measurement methods. Use this guide as a quick reference point when measuring and tracking customer satisfaction.

Why Is Customer Satisfaction Important?

The core reasons to prioritize customer satisfaction are customer loyalty, customer lifetime value and word-of-mouth brand promotion.

However, customer satisfaction can also be correlated to agent satisfaction (ASAT); when one side’s satisfaction levels improve, so do the other’s. Higher agent happiness supports improved performance, employee retention and decreased business and recruiting costs.

What Are the Benefits of Monitoring Customer Satisfaction?

As we’ve established, delivering a great customer experience makes good business sense from all angles. Measuring customer service satisfaction metrics allows you to find out whether or not you’re actually delivering exceptional CX.

You can identify what you’re already doing well and stick to those strategies. And, you can discover new pain points and areas that need improvement. With a data-driven customer service strategy in place, teams across your company will be empowered to formulate the best customer journey possible.

How Do You Measure Customer Service Performance and Success?

Finding the right customer satisfaction measurement system requires setting clear and actionable goals. When choosing metrics for measuring customer service and developing customer satisfaction survey questions, make sure these are aligned with higher-level objectives.

For instance, do you primarily want to track brand loyalty, improve case resolution time or monitor agent effectiveness? You’ll use different parameters to measure customer satisfaction than you would use to track agent performance.

If you’re seeking a 360-degree view of the quality, efficiency and effectiveness of your customer support, you might want to combine operational metrics with customer experience metrics for a more well-rounded perspective.

What Types of Metrics Measure Customer Satisfaction?

Here are the top four customer service satisfaction metrics to measure client satisfaction:

  1. Net promoter score (NPS)
  2. Customer satisfaction (CSAT) score
  3. Customer effort score (CES)
  4. Sentiment analysis

In essence, a quick customer metrics definition would be that NPS is a measure of loyalty, CES is a measure of effort, CSAT is a measure of satisfaction and sentiment analysis is a measure of emotion. Let’s take a closer look at each of these customer service satisfaction metrics.

What Is NPS?

Net promoter score is a calculation of the percentage of a company’s true advocates, and one of a surprisingly versatile customer satisfaction level measurement.

When asked a question such as, “How likely are you to recommend our brand to a friend or colleague?” and prompted to respond on a 10-point Likert scale (with 10 being “highly likely”), advocates are the customers who respond with nine or 10. Detractors are those who respond with a score from zero to six.

NPS is helpful in identifying strong brand advocates, but it also identifies those who are reporting a negative CX. If a customer leaves a low response, it’s good practice to reach out to find out where things went wrong and to offer proactive support.

Armed with more specific knowledge about why a customer gave a certain rating, customer service agents can directly address those issues, thereby potentially improving CX for all customers.

What Is CSAT Score?

Customer satisfaction score is one of the most insightful and specific customer satisfaction survey metrics. It’s used to measure an individual customer’s feelings about a specific interaction with your support team. Again, CSAT is measured through a Likert scale question.

“One of the benefits of CSAT surveys is that you can gather feedback from customers immediately after an interaction with your team,” explains Kustomer’s Senior Product Manager John Merse. “This helps you better understand customers’ experiences in real time. You can segment the results by agent, team and — most importantly — channel.”

For the most accurate assessment of customer satisfaction, you’ll need to measure CSAT across different channels and review the results collectively.

“In a true omnichannel environment it’s important to understand that each channel is unique and requires a specific communication style,” Merse adds. “For example, while you may have a 90%-plus satisfaction via email, if you are not tracking chat or SMS, you might find that your communication is not as effective and your overall customer satisfaction is not as high as you think.”

If you’re wondering what a good CSAT score is, check out this list of benchmarks segmented by industry from the American Customer Satisfaction Index.

What Is CES?

Customer effort score is a customer service metric that provides deeper insights into CX during a support interaction.

“You can essentially think of CES as tracking the effort a customer puts into using your product or service,” Merse says. “The more effort that is needed over time will likely erode their loyalty.”

A CES survey might ask to what extent a customer agrees with a statement like, “This company made it easy for me to handle my issue.” This score helps measure the overall effectiveness of support.

Gartner, which developed the CES metric, reports that customer effort is the most significant factor in a customer’s loyalty or disloyalty. Monitoring CES can help CX leaders uncover and remedy high-effort pain points in customer interactions for more frictionless support.

What Is Sentiment Analysis?

Sentiment analysis — also known as opinion mining — is the process of determining whether a customer’s language reflects positive, negative or neutral sentiment. Using natural language processing capabilities, CX professionals can gain automated insights into the emotions driving customer interactions.

Sentiment scores assign a numeric value to the message, conversation and customer. Reports based on sentiment changes or themes related to positive or negative sentiment can help you better understand your customers and the service they’re experiencing.

Can I Use CES in Combination With Sentiment, CSAT or NPS?

Absolutely! By combining customer service satisfaction metrics, you can access a more complete understanding of the customer support experience. For instance, although a CES score tells you effort level, it doesn’t get to the why of the customer’s response or how they feel overall about your brand. For that, you need additional customer service satisfaction metrics.

What are some strategies for improving customer satisfaction?

Here are six strategies that can have a huge payoff on CX and customer satisfaction rates:

  1. Utilize best-in-class customer service as a brand differentiator. Many customer-first brands and category disruptors have already done this, but it’s never too late for change at your own organization.
  2. Segment your satisfaction scores by demographics, products and support channels to uncover underlying problems in specific areas.
  3. Reinvest in your customer support team with new, customer-oriented skills and training programs.
  4. Deliver proactive support to minimize negative CX. This could involve sending notifications about shipping delays, getting ahead of negative reviews with offers or product exchanges and similar strategies.
  5. Provide customers with easily navigable self-service content. A strong knowledge base or FAQ section helps customers resolve basic issues on their own.
  6. Evaluate whether your customer service technology is truly empowering your agents to deliver exceptional quality. Have high expectations for your technology partners and find software solutions that support a unified omnichannel experience.

Got more questions about measuring and interpreting customer satisfaction metrics? Connect with a CX expert at Kustomer.
 

Elevating the Voice of the Customer with Hillary Curran

Elevating the Voice of the Customer with Hillary Curran TW

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In this episode of Customer Service Secrets, Gabe Larsen is joined by Hillary Curran to discuss customer experience and business operational strategies to make sure that the voice of the customer is heard. Hillary is currently the Director of Customer Service at Guru. She has been there for the last three years but initially started her career in nonprofits and technological development and support. She has helped develop and roll out software to aid those who want to help others. She is passionate about people; both coworkers and customers. In her interview with Gabe, she shared valuable insights about how to boost your customer experience and make the process easier for the company. Listen to the full episode below.

The Importance of Data Collection Both Internally and Externally

Having the right data at the right time is essential for the customer service industry. In order to ensure that customers are having a good experience, there has to be a way for them to leave feedback and make their voices heard. There are several things Hillary suggests companies should do to ensure customer data is recorded and acknowledged. For instance, Guru is a customer of their own service. Hillary states, “our whole company is also a customer, we use our own product internally. We want to make sure that we’re giving feedback about the product and what we are updating it accordingly.” Doing this has allowed Guru to get feedback in a myriad of ways and allows for employees to have complete empathy for the customer.

In addition to using your own product, Hillary notes that Slack channels are a great way to collect and share customer-gathered data with members of the whole company. This is a great tool that maximizes the amount of feedback received. Hillary mentions, “So a lot of data it’s being logged in different ways, but we try to make sure that it’s pushed to a channel on Slack so that most anyone across the company, even engineers or developers, can look through that and kind of learn as they go as well and potentially comment if they have ideas.” Doing this allows the voices of the customer to be heard throughout the company. Without internal data sharing, external feedback won’t ever be used to make a difference.

How to Share and Discuss Customer Feedback

After Hillary commented on the types of channels to use to communicate customer feedback, she describes the best way for that information to be shared. Sharing customer stories with all members of the company is a vital part of discussing customer feedback. Stories are powerful, motivating, and help all sectors of a company understand their customer better. Hillary suggests breaking down the company into pods with representatives from all departments is a great way to share the stories of the customers. These pods have engineers, designers, and members of the customer service team. Having Customer Service reps in the design process allows them to “bring those customer stories. Or, say ‘that actually looks like something that this one customer I’m working with may have an opinion about. I’d love to have you hop on a phone with them.’ And so just having a couple of people from customer experience in the design and engineering conversations can really help prevent a feature being built that maybe isn’t perfect yet or isn’t necessarily exactly what the customer wants.” Hillary continuously comments that weekly work meetings around discussing customer stories guarantees that something will be done in response to their feedback.

Why Closing the Communication Loop is Essential and How To Do It

Lastly, Hillary comments on what needs to be done after the data is collected, shared, evaluated, and acted upon. She points out that the next step for the company is to reach out to the customer thanking them for their feedback and letting them know what you have done with it. Hillary states, “every time we have a feature released that someone actually requested, we will pull out that report and send the customer a message letting them know that it’s being released at this time. … So yeah, we try to make sure that we’re always closing the loop on any feature requests that we get to make sure people understand that they’re not just like sending it to a black hole and that we actually are reading those and are taking them into account.” Whether it is through email or a phone call, communicating with customers who gave feedback is a great way to close the loop and ensure that the voice of the customer is heard.

To learn more about the voice of the customer and customer experience strategies, check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

 

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Listen to “Elevating the Voice of the Customer | Hilary Curan” on Spreaker.

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Full Episode Transcript:

Elevating the Voice of the Customer with Hillary Curran

Intro Voice: (00:04)
You’re listening to the Customer Service Secrets Podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen: (00:11)
Alright, welcome everybody. We’re excited to get going. Today we’re going to be talking about how to elevate the voice of the customer in a fully remote world, which we all find ourselves in at the moment. To do that, we brought on Hillary Curran. She’s currently the director of customer experience at Guru. Hillary, thanks for joining. How are you?

Hillary Curran: (00:29)
I’m doing great Gabe, it’s great to be here.

Gabe Larsen: (00:31)
Yeah, it’s different circumstances. She’s in Philly. I’m in Jersey, but we’re probably actually not too far away from each other, but we’re definitely not going into the office. Our office is in New York, so we are living in the remote world. But I’m excited to jump into the topic. Can you tell us just a little bit about yourself and kind of what you guys do over there at Guru?

Hillary Curran: (00:51)
Of course. So yeah, as Gabe mentioned, I lead the customer experience team at Guru. At Guru, the customer experience makes up our support team as well as our customer success function. So we get to work with customers one-on-one as well as in a one-to-many capacity. So, whether that’s through like email or chat or ticketing, we do all of it. We’re really the voice of the customer throughout the whole company. My journey to Guru: I’ve been here almost three years, started actually my background is in nonprofits and more like technical support. So, I’ve done a lot of stuff, a lot of work with software, rolling out software, at different nonprofits to help optimize solutions and have always loved working with people. I found myself in a customer support role and now lead a customer experience team. So super excited to be able to use a lot of my experiences across different industries and sectors here at Guru.

Gabe Larsen: (01:46)
Yeah. That is fun to kind of be part of — you kind of work in the customer experience space obviously, but your company obviously does a lot around that, so that’s fun to be able to kind of have both pillars there. Well, let’s dive into this concept. Before we were starting, I love the framework, right? As you think about how you guys really amplify the customer’s voice in this fully remote environment, there’s kind of a framework you took me through. Can you kind of set the stage with that?

Hillary Curran: (02:17)
Totally. So, even early before we were a fully remote team as we are today, Guru had two offices, one in San Francisco and one in Philadelphia. And so we’ve had to make sure that most of our communication is not necessarily just in person, but also somehow equitably sourced across the team. So, it’s been really, it’s been a good challenge as we’ve grown to make sure that we have opportunities for people to give and share and collect feedback from their customers that they’re talking to or even prospects. So the three things that we try to do are collect it in a myriad of ways, create places for people to discuss and share the feedback that’s timely and not once every quarter. And then also close the loop with customers. So if we do release a feature or if something comes out that someone requested or had a really strong passionate feelings about, we want to let them know so that they understand that we’re actually listening and doing something about it.

Gabe Larsen: (03:15)
Yeah, no, I think that’s one of the ways you’ve got to kind of manage because the world is different. You guys sound like you had an advantage because you were a little bit remote to start and so you’ve already kind of gone down this path and were a little bit more prepared than some of us. But, whether we were ready or not, we now have to dive into that. So I want to hit some of these concepts; this idea of collect, discuss and kind of close the loop. I just think that’s a cool framework to start really making sure you do this the right way. Let’s start with collect. What do you mean by that and how does that kind of work?

Hillary Curran: (03:52)
So at Guru, we always, I mean — there’s a ton of feedback that comes from our customer experience team. So customer success managers are hearing information on phone calls or when they’re onsite or customer meetings. Our sales team is hearing information when they’re on the phone with prospects, even with customers currently. But, there’s also a ton of insights that we get from other folks on the team. So if marketing sends out something particular and they get certain replies, like anyone on the team can really contribute to collecting feedback. And it’s something also really great about Guru is that our whole company is also a customer. So we use our own product internally. And so we also want to make sure that we’re giving feedback about the product and what we want to see change. And so we try to make sure that there’s a place for anyone and everyone to share the stories that they’re hearing about customers or customer insights as well as share their own information or ideas that they have while they’re using Guru day to day and then their workflow.

Hillary Curran: (04:49)
So we have a myriad of Slack channels. One is product feedback, which is sort of like an all encompassing catch-all. And this is where if you forward a specific email to a specific email address, all of that feedback will get sent to this channel so people can read it and thread conversations about it. We have everyone who uses our — who is talking to our customers would also send emails this way. We also collect feedback in our customer support tool. So we tag conversations with feedback as well as the features or certain ideas so we can see trends based on tags. So we’re collecting it as many ways as we can. And then all of the feedback is pushed to a tool we use called product board, which then allows our product management team to categorize and organize that based on teams. So a lot of it’s being logged in different ways, but we try to make sure that it’s pushed to a channel on Slack so that most anyone across the company, even engineers or developers can look through that and kind of learn as they go as well and potentially comment if they have ideas.

Gabe Larsen: (05:48)
Got it. So Slack has been kind of the main way you’ve been able to start facilitating some of that feedback mechanism, the collecting aspect of it.

Hillary Curran: (05:57)
Totally.

Gabe Larsen: (05:57)
And then a couple of different channels to think through that and do it in an appropriate way. Do you feel — has there been flaws or lessons learned from that or has it been — it sounds like you guys have a pretty good machine there working.

Hillary Curran: (06:13)
I think the collection is easy. Everyone can log things, whether it’s an email or in some form or fashion and some software. I think the hard part is elevating the stories and the trends and finding those that we have. We started to create a couple of other Slack channels to really highlight strategic customers or stories that we think are more relevant for the specific time. So, we created one a couple months ago called customer stories. That’s a little bit more storytelling oriented and talks about like direct quotes that we’ve had from customers that send us about like maybe how they’re dealing with their new work from home experiences to try and make sure that we’re elevating the stories that need to get shared, or that everyone needs to hear more broadly, and then also highlighting those. So we created a — now it’s a virtual meeting — but it’s a virtual meeting for the entire company to attend. And so the customer success team gathers all of those trends and tries to highlight those in that meeting, for everyone to get a quick snapshot of nine specific stories and trends that we’ve seen over the course of the last three or four weeks.

Gabe Larsen: (07:18)
Interesting. So that’s some of the internal stuff and then it sounds like there was some stuff you’ve done externally as well to get some of that customer involved as well, whether it was check-ins or– how have you worked that angle?

Hillary Curran: (07:31)
Totally. So, it’s been challenging now that we can’t go on-site or we can’t — and a lot of folks don’t want to –there’s a lot of other priorities right now. And so getting people on the phone, we want to make sure, as the customer experience team, that we’re giving people space to also adapt to this new environment and not try to bother people. At the same time we want to make sure that we’re being helpful. And so we’ve created a series of questions that we ask our customer experience team to sort of think on each week. And if they can incorporate those into a conversation they’re having, whether it’s in zoom or in an email or over chat, at least they can make sure that they’re digging in on one specific question. And then we can talk about the responses to that each week with the management team to sort of see trends and how is this information impacting your business, or have you seen an uptick in your usage of our product over the past three weeks? Like some sort of specific question that they can kind of grapple with versus how is everything going, which is so broad and sometimes hard to — for someone to respond to when there’s just a lot going on.

Gabe Larsen: (08:36)
Yeah. Well it is. It’s like when you get on these zoom meetings sometimes and you’re, “How’s the weather?” It’s like, “Well, how’s the weather where you are?” You know, I don’t want to talk about the weather. I have plenty to do. So getting a little more detailed, a little more into the person rather than keeping that so broad. So those have been some of the ways you’ve collected the data. Talk a little bit about the share and discuss.

Hillary Curran: (08:59)
Yeah. So like I mentioned, we do this sort of company wide meeting where the customer success team and support team and each talk about a very specific story or two stories that they’ve found really relevant. A lot of these will be backed with data around the number of people that have asked for a feature or had an issue potentially. And so we really like to highlight different customers. We’ll often sometimes share clips of customers so that anyone who’s listening can actually hear the customer on the phone. Which means it just goes so much further for an engineer to hear someone have an issue or really want a specific feature request when they can see it and hear it in their own words. So we try to use the “voice of the customers,” that we call it, every quarter and we just did our first fully remote one two weeks ago. And everyone reached out right after saying how great it was and refreshing, especially in this time to have some good stories and sort of feedback. We try to highlight both all the good things and also some of the negative things that we want to make sure people know about. But that’s been a really great way for the team to connect fully remote to just join for an hour and learn about all the things that our customers are saying.

Gabe Larsen: (10:06)
So it’s almost like the state of CX or, I mean it’s like what’s going on, some ups and downs, tickets, product requests; a little bit of everything.

Hillary Curran: (10:16)
Yeah. And then the other thing that we do more sort of as a structure of our company is our product teams are actually organized into pods, which are sort of miniature product development teams based on features. So we have product design engineers all assigned to different pods and typically these pods would meet every day and talk about what they’re going to work on, what they’re implementing, what they’re designing. What we’ve started with early on is we have two to three customer success and support reps also in these pods that joined for their standups to make sure that as they’re talking about what they’re going to build and what they’re working on, they can bring those customer stories. Or, say “that actually looks like something that this one customer I’m working with may have an opinion about. Like I’d love to have you hop on a phone with them.” And so just having a couple of people from customer experience in the design and engineering conversations can really help prevent a feature being built that maybe isn’t perfect yet or isn’t necessarily exactly what the customer wants. And also make sure that we can iterate more quickly with direct customer feedback because we have a ton of customers that want to talk to our engineering team all the time. It’s very rare that you get insights like that, so they’re always like, I’d love to talk to them.

Gabe Larsen: (11:31)
Got it, got it. And so the pod structure probably enables that actually a little bit more effectively than a non pod structure. I can see how that may work.

Hillary Curran: (11:40)
Yeah. We used to have like a company wide design meeting where we would walk through all the designs and it becomes one of those like too many cooks in the kitchen where everyone has ideas. And so we had to scale it back and say, how can we focus a little bit and allow everyone to have a little bit of a say and opinion. So, it’s been really cool to see and it allows like some younger, more junior folks on the team, to get experience and get exposed to other departments that they may not have ever really worked with directly.

Gabe Larsen: (12:10)
Hmm. And talk to us a little bit about this “glows grows” idea this — what’s that?

Hillary Curran: (12:16)
Yeah. So even internally on our customer experience team, what each meeting that we have on Mondays every week to kick off the week, we do a glow and a grow; which is what can we be proud about? What happened really great with a customer and whether it was like how they launched the product or maybe they revamped their instance, or something that we want to grow from and learn from. And so a lot of these stories are really helpful and when we try to share them in the Slack channels and we often have other team members come to our customer experience meetings on Mondays and they always say that this is like their favorite part of the meeting cause they get to hear those customer stories and hear what’s going on in the Zoom rooms all around the world.

Gabe Larsen: (13:00)
Yeah. You got it. I mean that type of check-in I think brings everybody on the same page and obviously sets you up for the week on the right foot. We’ll do that on Mondays, if I can. So you obviously have some great strategies. Oh, I did want to hear about this lab. So talk to me about the lab, what’s that?

Hillary Curran: (13:17)
So many things we’ve implemented. So the last one that we did recently, Guru actually didn’t have a pretty robust account management team until recently. And so our customer experience and account management team has really started to work much more closely together. And in doing so — the way that our teams are structured customer success as well as account managers work together with accounts so it’s not like the CSM owns the entire customer experience. So we really wanted to make sure there was a place for both of those teams to come together and share specifically challenges they have maybe around renewal or maybe the champion that they worked with last or went on maternity leave and they have no idea who to reach out to again. Whatever the issue is, just having a place for those teams to come together and share their experiences has been really helpful.

Hillary Curran: (14:03)
So isn’t necessarily a customer voice, it’s more of like sharing customer stories to help influence other outcomes. And so it’s been really cool to have like maybe one more senior person on the team say, I’ve heard this scenario, I’ve had this experience before. Let me explain to you how I dealt with it with this one customer. And so that’s been really cool and it’s allowed folks to sort of share experiences without having to have — like right now we don’t have the ability to walk by and talk with someone or overhear a conversation at the office. So, we’re trying to kind of clear the space for those types of things to happen.

Gabe Larsen: (14:37)
Interesting. Well let’s get into this close the loop idea and how you bring it to the end. How do you look at that and play that?

Hillary Curran: (14:46)
Totally. So more of a one-to-one version would be for all those pods that we have, if there’s a customer success manager in those pods that has a customer that has requested a very specific feature that is gonna get implemented or that they know a feature that their customer would really love to give feedback on, they can legitimately engage the customer and tell them what’s going on, play by play as we’re developing it, as we’re adjusting it, which is really cool for the customer to get to have that kind of connection with that specific feature or workflow that’s going to get developed. So that’s one way that we try to close the loop, by just keeping the customers like, “Hey, I know you wanted us to create a feature where you could use emojis and making something up. It’s coming out, we’re working on it. Actually they’d love to talk to you about this one thing that they’re thinking of.” So just making sure that they can stay in the loop. And then more sort of from a systematic like one to many version we, because we’re cataloging and logging all of these different requests, every time we have a feature that gets released that someone did request, we will pull that report and then send them a message letting them know that it’s being released on this time. We really appreciated why they — all the time. Maybe it was two years ago, they asked for this, but it’s going to finally come out and thanks for your patience. So yeah, we try to make sure that we’re always closing the loop on any feature requests that we get to make sure people understand that they’re not just like sending it to a black hole and that we actually are reading those and are taking them into account.

Gabe Larsen: (16:16)
And have you found that there’s certain ways to do that? I mean, is email typically the best way to do that? Do you have a system to kind of track those lists? Because oftentimes people, they want to close the loop, but they drop the ball, they forget. There’s not a great way sometimes. Have you found a good way to do that or technology?

Hillary Curran: (16:33)
Yeah. Well, in our support system, if people ask for a specific feature and we log it, it captures their email address. So that’s one way. And then, um, if someone has requested it and we send it to the product board, we’ll also capture their email address so we can pull like a legitimate list of emails. What we often do is send a mass, either through chat, bot, sort of pop up message or sometimes we’ll actually post. We have a product called Pendo as well, but is sort of a guide that walks you through goals and such. So sometimes we can also make up a custom list inside of that and then like highlights specific things that we may have released to specific groups of users. So that’s been kind of a newer way that we’ve done it. So what we try not to send too many emails; but, whether it’s a chat or even if you just tell someone on Zoom, if you’re having a call with them, “Hey, this is coming out, we wanted you to know. Thank you for all of your feedback the 5,000 times that you told us that this was a really important feature. So, we try to do it and not just email because sometimes I think those get buried. Yeah. Most people are really responsive.

Gabe Larsen: (17:38)
That’s the problem, email. Now in our inbox, we’ve got so many more emails coming in because some of the things are not working. Well Hillary, we really appreciate you taking the time. Love the idea of that process that you outlined. How do you really think about collecting the data that you need in order to make the right decisions? How do you discuss that and share it amongst the people in the right way and make sure you close that loop. As we’re in these challenging times and thinking about your job, what would be your recommendation or advice as we leave today to other directors of customer experience who are struggling trying to manage some of these different aspects of the business?

Hillary Curran: (18:19)
Totally. I would say try not to be in every Slack channel like me. It gets overwhelming. I think that’s one. I would say that despite all of these different tools and tactics that we have, I think the number one thing that’s really important is to have leadership, buy-in, and also support to make sure that this stuff happens and that people actually show up to all of these meetings and events. And so very fortunate for me, at Guru our CEO and really all of our leadership team has been super supportive of sharing customer stories and making sure that any sort of issue that we see is popping up more and more should be raised to the engineering team. Making sure that there’s buy-in from them. And if there isn’t, trying to use the data that you have from all the different places that you can to really make a case for yourself as to why this is important. So trying to use the data is also really helpful. But I think having buy-in from your leadership team, even just to try out one of these solutions is key.

Gabe Larsen: (19:19)
I mean, the data thing, it’s been so relevant to me lately. I feel like sometimes in the customer world we opened up a little bit with that. It’s a little bit of hearsay or you hear one thing and it’s man, if there is a way to bring the data in and strong leaders can do that I think it can make a big difference. So Hillary is so fun to have you. Certainly wish you the best. If someone wants to get to know you or learn a little bit more about some of the fun things you guys are doing, what’s the best way to do that?

Hillary Curran: (19:44)
Yeah, you can just find me on LinkedIn, just Hillary Curran, or send me an email. I think my email is probably on it. It’s just hcurran@guru.com. I’m happy to always connect and I love talking about customer experience and knowledge management and support and all those good things that people need.

Gabe Larsen: (20:03)
Yeah, I know we were chatting about some other topics, so you might have to be a regular, we might have to bring you back next quarter or something.

Hillary Curran: (20:09)
I’d love to. I’d love to. Maybe next time we can do it in person.

Gabe Larsen: (20:12)
That’s true. That’s true. We’re not too far from each other. So again, thanks for joining and for everybody else. Have a fantastic day.

Exit Voice: (20:26)
Thank you for listening. Make sure you subscribe to hear more customer service secrets.

 

The Customer in the Future with Blake Morgan

The Customer in the Future with Blake Morgan TW

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In this episode of Customer Service Secrets, Blake Morgan joins Gabe Larsen to discuss the importance of focusing on the customer and its role in attracting more customers. For the last 12 years, Blake has been in the customer service industry as either a practitioner or thought leader. She got her start as a customer service executive at Intel and for the past 5 years she has been a keynote speaker. Blake is dedicated to helping prepare businesses for the modern customer and helping them become the companies of the future. She is also the author of The Customer of the Future and hosts her own podcast titled “The Modern Customer.” Listen to the full episode below.

The Customer and Company of the Future

Times are changing very quickly and the customer service industry is not immune. The modern customers are in an interesting situation because they are being exposed to a variety of service experiences and not all of them are good. So what exactly should we expect from the company of the future? Blake states, “The company of the future has a soul. The company of the future is thoughtful. They’re thinking about more than just how much money they’re making the next quarter. They’re looking at the implications their behavior has on not just the customer, but the employee, the community, the environment. They’re thinking about innovation as a core piece of their competitive strategy.” If these are the characteristics of future companies, how does your company compare?

Why This Change is Slow

There is a very pressing need for change, but it is happening at a much slower pace than what is needed. Blake suggests that this is happening because of the nature of CEOs and their short time investments in companies along with the need to change culture. Changing a company’s culture and being willing to make a long term investment into customer experience isn’t always appealing and is not a quick fix. One of the elements of Blake’s philosophies is the psychological aspect of customer service. This involves the mindset and the culture. If CEOs were willing to invest more time, be more patient and persistent, psychological and cultural changes would occur in a company. Blake recalls, “Customer experience has to permeate through the culture of the company. It has to be in the fabric, in the mission, the values, the way people talk. We’ve got to have that humble, open culture. It’s not easy to simply replicate what somebody else does, especially for big companies that have toxic cultures or have cultures where things move very slowly and change is hard. I think it’s extremely difficult for these companies to change the culture, which is the biggest piece.” Making these changes is a slow process normally, but Blake is optimistic that it will speed up as companies apply the principles in her book and invest more fully in customer experience.

What it Takes for a Company to Stand Out

In the middle of their discussion, Gabe asked a simple, yet powerful question, “Why does CX matter?” Blake’s response is that in today’s world, there is so much product competition that simply having a good idea isn’t enough. She further explains that by excelling in the customer service and customer experience department, companies can manifest their value. It’s important for companies to take the time to care about people and recognize the humanity of the customer. As Blake so eloquently describes, “In a time where many of our products and services are the same, customer experience is the only way to stand out. Our products and services have become commodities or simply competing on price. And maybe that in the short term, but in the long term we want to be relevant. We have to compete on experience on how we make people feel… Thoughtfulness is truly a competitive advantage today.” Quality customer service and experience is essential for the companies of the future and the customers of the future demand nothing less.

To learn more about the customer and company of the future, check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

 

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Full Episode Transcript:

The Customer in the Future with Blake Morgan

Intro Voice: (00:04)
You’re listening to the Customer Service Secrets Podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen: (00:11)
Hi, welcome everybody to today’s show. I’m excited to get going. We’re going to be talking about the future of the customer or the customer being the future. To do that, we brought on Blake Morgan. She is a customer experience expert. She does keynote speaking. She also happens to have a new book coming out called “The Customer of the Future.” It talks about 10 guiding principles that we’ll dive on to just a little bit today. So Blake, thanks for joining. How are you?

Blake Morgan: (00:39)
Hi. Good, thank you. Thanks for having me on your podcast. I love podcasting. I have my own podcasts, so —

Gabe Larsen: (00:46)
That’s right. Can you tell us, maybe add that in, but tell us a little more about you and some of the fun things you do in your day to day.

Blake Morgan: (00:57)
Well, what’s super fun now is I am 29 weeks pregnant, so I’m a mom.

Gabe Larsen: (01:05)
It’s your first?

Blake Morgan: (01:05)
It’s my second.

Gabe Larsen: (01:08)
Okay, congratulations.

Blake Morgan: (01:09)
Yeah. So you asked me what’s fun. So I guess that’s like fun. That’s fun news. I also have two dogs. They’re fun as well. And a husband. The one thing I do is I bring my message that if you focus on the customer, if you make people’s lives easier and better, you will always attract customers to you. And that’s the basic message that I bring all around the world, whether it’s on a stage, on my podcast “The Modern Customer,” on my Forbes column. It’s a simple human message that we’ve gotten too far away from treating people like wallets. And we have to be real about how we are building and designing experiences for other people and how do we make them feel?

Blake Morgan: (01:57)
And now feelings are a business metric. And that’s really exciting for people like me. For over 12 years I’ve been telling stories about why how you make people feel matters. And now, businesses are starting to draw the correlation between, oh gosh, we’re making people feel like junk. And I can see our market share shrinking. Oh, it makes sense. So it’s been a pleasure to be able to do this job and I’ve been doing it for about five years, completely focusing on thought leadership. And before that I was a practitioner as an executive at Intel, the chip maker. But I’ve been in the customer world for about 12 years whether as a customer service executive practitioner or on the thought leadership side producing content.

Gabe Larsen: (02:46)
I love it. I love it. Well, let’s dive in. That’s a great intro. I want to hear a little bit about the book, but the looming question– I always like to think about titles and you’ve got this kind of customer of the future. So maybe start there. Who is the customer of the future?

Blake Morgan: (03:00)
The customer of the future. She is already here and I recently heard a quote that “the future is here, It’s just not widely distributed.” And I love that because you know, in your life you’re getting some beautifully easy, seamless, zero friction, personalized customer experiences from companies like Spotify and Netflix and Amazon and Apple products. And depending on where you get your healthcare or your airline, I mean hopefully you’re with the best, but many of us are not. So you’re getting these wonderfully delicious experiences in some areas of your life. But like if we look at the five most hated industries, they are travel, especially air travel, insurance, cable, Telekom and wireless services and internet services. So basically many of these experiences are extremely broken. But then, when we say the future is not widely distributed, but it’s here, the customer is comparing those horrible experiences with the wonderful ones they get. So everyone today is being held to a different standard.

Gabe Larsen: (04:14)
Wow. Yeah. You nailed it with the industries. I’m thinking of my cable bill, my Telekom bill, and like yes, me, me, me. But you’re right, times definitely are changing. So how does that compare to the company of the future? Is that similar? Does it have to react differently with some of the different changes with the customer of the future.

Blake Morgan: (04:37)
Yeah. The company of the future has a soul. The company of the future is thoughtful. They’re thinking about more than just how much money they’re making the next quarter. They’re looking at the implications their behavior has on not just the customer, but the employee, the community, the environment. They’re thinking about innovation as a core piece of their competitive strategy. And that’s why you see — when I put out my lists on Forbes of the most customer centric companies, these are companies that do everything well. They’re good to their people, they have a huge innovation focus, they are good on customer service and they also are trying to look at ways to be more sustainable, to impact the community in a positive way. And so they do everything well. And that’s why when people ask me, Blake, what are the most customer focused companies in the world, I just point them to the great place to work list because we see that companies that are great places to work often have excellent customer experiences and their stock prices are going up as a result.

Gabe Larsen: (05:49)
Yeah, and that first thing you said; companies won’t just look kind of at the numbers, you know, they’ll have a soul. Well why is that so hard to make that transition? Is it that hard? Is it just something we got to kind of do? Because I feel like you still have leaders getting up there and yeah, it’s all the almighty dollar and that does matter. But if the customer is not happy the dollar doesn’t come. It’s like they’re not getting it. Why is that not happening? Or is it as simple — is it changing your mindset or what’s going on there?

Blake Morgan: (06:23)
Yeah, I think we have to look at what individual leaders are measured by and what their goals are. If you think of a CEO, they often come in, take over at a big company and their goal is to be there a few years, turn the company around, make it profitable and then move on to a better paying or more fancy, we’ll say, CEO job. And that’s a problem because for these customer experience programs, they required long term investments. They often require being misunderstood for long periods of time. And when founder CEOs, they focus on their businesses, it’s often the long term view because they aren’t held to the standards by the board. They don’t really care because they’ve built the company, it’s their baby. And they’re willing to be misunderstood. Yeah, like Reed Hastings of Netflix. So I think that’s one of the problems is that the performance metrics for these leaders are not in service of customer experience. They’re in service of the almighty dollar, quick turnarounds. And it’s really a conflict when we think about things like digital transformation that require at least five years or so of sometimes taking a loss in order to transform into a better company.

Gabe Larsen: (07:52)
Yeah, that’s so interesting looking at some of the different examples of like a turnaround CEO versus an original founder, right? That mindset of this is my family, or this is — there’s just such a different futuristic view on that. You mentioned the Netflix gentlemen as an example, you’re right, they kind of see things different. The CEO compensation, yeah that probably would change behavior, right? What are you actually here to do?

Blake Morgan: (08:22)
Right, exactly.

Gabe Larsen: (08:24)
So, in all of this going on in the world, we talked a little bit about the future of the company, the future of the customer. CX, a lot of people debate its importance. Why, why does it matter so much today?

Blake Morgan: (08:38)
So in a time where many of our products and services are the same, customer experience is the only way to stand out. Our products and services have become commodities or simply competing on price. And maybe that in the short term, but in the long term we want to be relevant. We have to compete on experience on how we make people feel. Um, and that’s why I think customer experience is the great leveling field of our time because any tiny company can build something that’s simply better where they take something that has been the way we do business for a long time that customers hate and just said, well, let’s make it better. Why does it have to be like this? And they simply win by creating something that people just love and can’t stop using. It often comes from frustration. There’s a company called Good Grips or Oxo Grips and the founder of Oxo Grips, which is a company that makes things that are like easy to handle.

Blake Morgan: (09:42)
Like in my shower, I have a window wipe, I guess you’d call it, or like a glass — I don’t even know what the name for this is. Basically, when your shower gets all streaky, it wipes the shower down and it has an amazing grip. And the reason this founder created this company, Oxo Grips was his wife had I believe Parkinson’s or her hands shook. She had a disease where her hands shook and she couldn’t hold things well. And so he created this company with products that were easy for people who had disabilities to be able to hold them. I think some of the best innovation just comes from frustration. Like why does it have to be like this? It can be better. And let’s just build it. And so you asked, why customer experience? Why now? It’s the great leveling field of our time. Experience matters. It is the only way to make a customer remember us and we can no longer simply rest on our laurels and ride our legacies into the future. It just won’t work anymore.

Gabe Larsen: (10:44)
Why, that is true, right? I mean, it’s like when you think you’ve got a cool product innovation and oftentimes, it can be knocked off. Whether it’s here or somewhere else. But yeah, that service level is one of those things that in particular about the customer. And there are multiple areas I think in the customer experience, but I like the service. What’d you say? What’d you call that? The great leveling field for — yeah, there’s something to that. That’s so bloody hard or whatever word you want to use. I’m not, not British, but it’s so hard to meet or knock off because that does require a culture and all these different, kind of, aspects where its products sometimes you can find the ingredients and you can do it quicker. So let’s dive quickly just into the book for a minute. Where is the book at the moment? It’s obviously — we can see it here on your LinkedIn profile, but give us some of the different topics in the book and some of the things you hit on there.

Blake Morgan: (11:46)
Yeah. The book is live, it’s been out since October. I’m really excited because it became a best seller on Amazon and Porchlight books, which is where the conference organizers buy books and the book is based on my 10 guiding principles. In my speeches, I bucket that into three categories and that includes the psychological, technical, and experiential aspects of a strategy. The psychological, the first piece, is the most overlooked piece of a customer experience strategy. And that’s mindset, culture, and leadership development because we don’t realize that the answers are often right in front of our nose and they’re free. But we don’t want to look at our culture. We don’t want to think about, well how do the executives walk around and talk about customers at our company. The second piece is the technical piece and that’s where I dive into digital transformation. Analytics.

Blake Morgan: (12:43)
What is customer experience technology? What does the market look like? And I talk about personalization. And then in the third piece we look at the experiential aspects of the strategy, which are more about marketing, which are more about data ethics and privacy. And lastly, experience design. And so the three pieces again in the book: psychological, technical and experiential aspects of strategy. You won’t find it bucketed like that in the book, you’ll find the 10 principles. But when I’m talking about it 10 is just too damn many for anybody to sit through me. It sounds like a laundry list. So for the sake of like keynotes or podcasts, I explain it in these three buckets, which I think people, it’s easier for them to get.

Gabe Larsen: (13:33)
Three is always a little easier than 10. Where do you feel are the best or the worst as you think about these three buckets? Or is there areas that you typically see we kind of are floundering the most or maybe have the biggest strengths?

Blake Morgan: (13:48)
Yeah, I think that the first is mindset. The biggest is mindset and culture. Because most companies, what they do– and I talk about this often because it’s like the biggest bruise in my industry– is they hire a chief customer officer or they hire an experienced group and that group or that person has no power, no influence, no one in the company really even knows who they are, or what they do. It’s just putting lipstick on a pig really. And even when I worked at a fortune 100 company, I remember asking my boss, because I was an executive in customer service and I said, we have a customer experience group. Well what do they do? And she said to me, Oh, I think they produce events. And I thought, what? That makes no sense. Customer experience has to permeate through the culture of the company. It has to be in the fabric, in the mission, the values, the way people talk. We’ve got to have that humble, open culture. It’s not easy to simply replicate what somebody else does, especially for big companies that have toxic cultures or have cultures where things move very slowly and change is hard. I think it’s extremely difficult for these companies to change the culture, which is the biggest piece. Instead of just hiring one person, like a chief experience officer and then just saying that, okay, we’ve done our job.

Gabe Larsen: (15:15)
Is there a leader or a company that you would highlight that kind of embraces some of these concepts? The customer experience, customer service in a way that is something that maybe you aspire to? Whether it’s the cultural aspect or one of these different ideas. Where would you go with that?

Blake Morgan: (15:35)
Yeah, I would say that from a culture perspective, Workday is one I really like. The founders are just good people and if you find inside the company, just the stories you hear are just human stories of leaders doing the right thing for employees. And they’re one of those companies that’s on the great place to work list. And they’re also known for customer experience. You can’t really talk about customer experience without talking about Amazon. They have changed the game for everyone. I went to Amazon because I wanted to know like, was there any magic or would I find bunnies being pulled out of hats at Amazon headquarters and when I did the tours and met with executives. What I found is that there was no secret sauce or magic that it’s simply a company that’s run extremely efficiently, focused on innovation, very hardworking, humble people. I met a head of logistics who would go driving with his delivery people at two in the morning just to see some of the hiccups or hindering blocks in their process to make more efficient operations for his employees. And I think most people in big companies just don’t have the stomach or the commitment to go through that to go on a 2:00 AM drive just to make something 10% more efficient.

Gabe Larsen: (17:02)
Yeah, that’s what it feels like they’ve been able to do. Right. It’s like that effortless experience. I know I’m stealing that word from others. But they seem like they have mapped that customer journey a billion times. They just know exactly where — they’ve just eliminated every, well, they’ve eliminated a lot of different headaches to make it so easy to do business with them that you’re like, I’d rather do that than go somewhere else. Well Blake, I really appreciate the time. It’s a fun talk track. I’m excited. Blake was a referral. I was talking to someone else and they said you’ve got to talk to Blake who’s got this new book.

Blake Morgan: (17:40)
Thanks Dan.

Gabe Larsen: (17:40)
So I quickly researched her. I wrote out to her, I ordered the book and it gets here in a couple of days. I’ll have to check that out. I’m trying to learn more about the whole customer experience and customer service. So I appreciate the talk track. In summary and then maybe for people who want to learn a little bit more about what you do Blake, how would you bring it to a close?

Blake Morgan: (18:02)
In summary, I think the best thing you can do for your business is hire sensitive, empathetic people who are interested in other people’s experiences. And these are the people that will build beautiful customer experiences because they’re very thoughtful and they really think about what it feels like to be on the receiving end of something. And that’s truly the number one thing is hire thoughtful people, whether they’re leaders, employees, customer focused agents. Thoughtfulness is truly a competitive advantage today. And if you want to learn more about me, I would love to connect with your listeners. Come to my website blakemichellemorgan.com. I’m launching a new podcast soon on entrepreneurship with my husband Jacob Morgan. So hopefully you’ll find that as well on my website and would love, any way I can help, anybody listening please reach out.

Gabe Larsen: (18:58)
Yeah, that’s so fun. As I was talking to Blake pre show it was like I honestly don’t know how to introduce you. You got all these different accolades and things you’re doing. So where should I start? So anyways, do check her out. I think that’s a great idea. We will make sure we put some of that in the show notes. So Blake, thanks for joining. For the audience, have a fantastic day.

Blake Morgan: (19:17)
Thank you so much. I enjoyed it.

Exit Voice: (19:20)
Thank you for listening. Make sure you subscribe to hear more customer service secrets.

 

The Cult of the Customer with Shep Hyken

The Cult of the Customer with Shep Hyken TW

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In this episode of Customer Service Secrets, Gabe Larsen is joined by Shep Hyken to discuss his book, The Cult of the Customer and the different phases of customer experience. Shep Hyken is a customer service expert and has spent 37 years in the industry. He is passionate about customer loyalty, engagement, and management. He is a keynote speaker, a New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestselling author and is currently the CSP, CPAE, and CAO (Chief Amazement Officer) at Shepard Presentations. Shep is very knowledgeable and brings valuable insights to the table as he and Gabe discuss the five “cults” in his book. Listen to the full episode below.

Why Use the Word “Cult” with Customer Service?

Most of the time when people see the word cult, they automatically think of small groups of individuals with negative and radical beliefs. “Cult” does not typically have a positive connotation. However, by discussing the latin origins of the word, Shep explains that it actually means a group of people with common interests and a unified goal. In this sense, cults aren’t inherently bad and the word could reference a lot of different groups. Shep states, “It’s a group of people that have a common interest and in this case, the cult of the customer is all about people that are fanatical, if you will, about taking care of their customers, both internal and external…” Throughout his book, Shep uses this word not only to describe the overall commitment and passion to positive customer service, he uses the word “cult” to describe different phases of the experience.

The Five Cults, or Phases, for Customers and Employees

To better understand the experience of customers, Shep created these five cults. The first is uncertainty, meaning that the customer is lacking knowledge or experience with the company. After moving through uncertainty, the customer arrives at alignment. In this phase they better understand what the company actually does and the company’s mission. Third is experience: where the customer actually has personal experiences with the product or service. Fourth, take ownership. When a company takes ownership for any unfortunate mistakes or mishaps, they gain the customer’s trust. Fifth, amazement. Shep recalls, “Now if it is positive and it’s predictable and consistent, you’re actually operating into the ultimate cult, the cult of amazement.” Additionally, Shep relates these phases to employees as well as customers. For example, when a new employee joins a company they have uncertainty, then they learn and align, have experiences, take ownership, and then, hopefully, enter the amazed state.

Consistency and Amazement as a Realistic Goal

While reaching the amazement cult and staying there seems like an unattainable goal, Shep assures that it is possible. It may be a fluid experience but it is possible. To understand how it is possible, Shep defines amazement as being “consistently better than average.” By taking the time to understand customer expectations and then creating better than average standards, customer loyalty will spike as well as customer satisfaction. Consistency is the key to being in the amazement cult. To make this point clear, Shep states:

I’ve been talking about consistency since the 80s. No matter how good you are, if you’re one day good and the next day okay– even if you ever dropped below average– you’re still going to be seen as inconsistent . . . To be better than average means simply as Horst Schulze, the cofounder and first president of the Ritz Carlton Hotel Organization, said “If you want to create a world class brand and be recognized for amazing service, just be 10% better than average all the time.”

Finding the weaknesses or trouble spots in your company, reevaluating customer expectations, and creating goals of consistency is the way to help every customer have an “amazing experience.”

To learn more about The Cult of the Customer and its various applications in the customer experience realm, check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

 

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Listen to “The Cult of the Customer w/Shep Hyken” on Spreaker.

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Full Episode Transcript:

The Cult of the Customer | Shep Hyken

Intro Voice: (00:04)
You’re listening to the Customer Service Secrets Podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen: (00:11)
Hi, welcome everybody. Today we’re going to be talking about cult, the cult of the customer. I think it’ll be a fun dialogue. To do that, we brought in Shep Hyken, probably heard about him. I’ve been tracking him for six months. People have probably been doing it longer, but I’m newer to this space so that’s my excuse. He is a customer service and experience expert, New York Times bestselling, he’s got an author, keynote speaker, and he does run his own company. So, you’ll see him across multiple channels, very active on social, got a podcast. I think we’ll learn a lot today and I would definitely advise after, to make sure you follow some of his thought leadership content. So Shep, thanks for joining and how are you?

Shep Hyken: (00:54)
Hey, thanks for having me. Great to be here. Excited. And while you may have only been doing it six months, I’ve been doing this about 37 years. So, I don’t know if any — I guess I have had followers for 37 years because there are people, this is true. My very first contract I ever signed to do a speech was in 1983 with the company, Anheuser-Busch, or Budweiser. Yeah. And just about two months ago — I mean, I’ve worked with them, gosh a hundred times, maybe more over those years. Okay. But my most recent one was just a couple of months ago. So some of those people had been following me for a long time.

Gabe Larsen: (01:33)
Wow.

Shep Hyken: (01:33)
And hiring me.

Gabe Larsen: (01:33)
You say 1983? Is that what you said?

Shep Hyken: (01:36)
Yeah. Yeah. Before you were born maybe?

Gabe Larsen: (01:38)
I don’t want to go into it, but it’s pretty close.

Shep Hyken: (01:41)
I know. I look young and I’ll tell you why. I cut my hair off. Just shave it all off. No, you can’t see — has he got gray hair? Well, unless I take my shirt off, you won’t know. Back hair could be gray, but hey, we’re not going to do that here. But seriously, old guys that are bald, they don’t look old until one day they do look old. But I’ve got about another 10 years before that happens.

Gabe Larsen: (02:05)
Yeah. Well I won’t make you share your age, but it sounds like 37– That’s a long…we’ll just go with that.

Shep Hyken: (02:10)
1983 I started my business. Yep.

Gabe Larsen: (02:12)
You are a seasoned professional. Wow. Well again, tons of information we’re going to try to dive into it today. Let’s start high level cause when I saw this book, I mean it is kind of a revised edition coming out, but this idea of cult. I mean most people see that and they’re like cult, that’s some weird people doing some weird stuff in some weird place.

Shep Hyken: (02:34)
It’s got the rep. It’s got the rap and the rap — got the reputation and a bad rap. Cult is actually, it’s an interesting word. And by the way, this is a completely updated, revised edition; new stats, facts. We took out a few of the case studies that weren’t relevant. We got rid of some names of people that are in jail now that we used as examples. They’re now, they’re no longer part of the book. True. That’s true. I won’t tell you who it is either. No, it’s true. There was a guy in there who’s in jail right now. He’s out of the book.

Shep Hyken: (03:05)
You never know what’s going to happen. Right?

Gabe Larsen: (03:08)
You don’t, you don’t.

Shep Hyken: (03:08)
So, the word cult. When I sent the book out, the first time the book came out, I actually sent it to a bunch of my clients. One client sent it back, a healthcare system that has a religious persuasion and said, the word cult disgusts me. You will never work for my company again.

Gabe Larsen: (03:28)
Whoa you’re kidding.

Shep Hyken: (03:28)
Whoa, Whoa. I apologize profusely. But, if you read the back cover of the book or the inside jacket, it says cult is not a dirty word. The word cult is really, first of all, it comes from the word cultus, the Latin word cultus, which means care and tending which is interesting. But beyond that, the actual definition of a cult is not about fanaticism. It’s about a group of people with common interests headed toward the same direction, doing the same thing.

Gabe Larsen: (03:59)
Is that right?

Shep Hyken: (03:59)
So, in effect, it could be a religious order, but it could also be a bunch of people who go out and it’s almost like religion. Every Sunday morning you see them running through the park, working out together. So it’s a group of people that have a common interest and in this case, the cult of the customer is all about people that are fanatical, if you will, about taking care of their customers, both internal and external; creating an environment that’s care and tending toward those people. And, ideally doing such a great job that these customers, especially the outside customers, become evangelists; which is why the subtitle is “Create an amazing customer experience that turns satisfied customers into customer evangelists.” People that will praise what you do and share and spread the word about how great you are.

Gabe Larsen: (04:50)
I love that. You know, I don’t — there was another gentleman, Russell Brunson, he’s kind of a marketing guru.

Shep Hyken: (04:56)
Yep I know Russell.

Gabe Larsen: (04:57)
Cult-ure. Like CULTure, culture. Like something that people are a little more intense about that they really care about and want to be a part of. You’re right. I like that the history shows that it’s not just a negative, kind of crazy people that we sometimes assume. But there is kind of a positive– just a group of people that are really dynamic in following the cause.

Shep Hyken: (05:19)
So here’s some trivia. I’ll give you trivia that I’ve never shared with anybody before. I don’t think I have anyway. So when this– I did not come up with this title. When I was approached by Wiley a dozen plus years ago to write this book, I had the idea that would be called “The Customer Focus,” which is after my training programs.

Gabe Larsen: (05:41)
Okay.

Shep Hyken: (05:41)
And they said, we’ve got a different title. We would like you to consider, “The Cult of the Customer.” Whoa, that’s an interesting name: Cult. The “cult” caught my attention too. So ironically, that summer I saw a woman speak, she was wonderful. She’s the one that came up with the Aflac commercial. “Aflac.” So she talked about how it would be a polarizing commercial; that people would love this because it’s funny, people would hate it because it’s stupid, but everybody else would remember it no matter what because who’s going to forget Aflac. Right? And so, I asked her. I had a chance to ask her about the word cult in the title, and she says it will do the same thing that Aflac does in a sense. And that if people are walking through the bookstore and they see “The Cult of The Customer,” they may stop and look at that word cult because it jumps out at them.

Shep Hyken: (06:34)
And it may cause them to pick up the book and look at it. Some people, it’ll just like, “who would use that word in a title,” and others will go, “well that’s a really interesting way of putting it.” So in effect — but everybody remembers that word cult because it just stands out.

Gabe Larsen: (06:49)
Oh my heavens. When I first saw it, it did.I think you nailed it.

Shep Hyken: (06:54)
Thank you.

Gabe Larsen: (06:54)
It’s a little bit of a head turner. You walked by and probably some people are like, what? But other people are like — so whatever it is, good for you because it worked.

Shep Hyken: (07:04)
It worked. We sold a lot of books. When it first came out, it immediately, interesting. It was the number one book of all books sold on Amazon for just a real short time. But it was the number one book. It stayed number one in business for weeks and weeks. It also hit the Wall Street Journal list, the USA Today list. And I was surprised it didn’t hit the New York Times. The next one did. But this one still, it hit a bunch of good lists.

Gabe Larsen: (07:31)
Wow, well, congratulations on a bunch of books. Yeah, I’m sure the title had something to do it, but the content as well. So let’s hit the content. Can you talk about these five cults or phases customers go through? Maybe start there.

Shep Hyken: (07:45)
So, I started to look at — my goal in life is to simplify the complicated. And it’s not even that complicated. We want to create an experience that gets people to want to come back. Well, let’s talk about what people are thinking through their journey. And the first time a customer decides to do business with someone, no matter how good the reputation is, they can only hope that it’s going to be as good as what’s promised.

Shep Hyken: (08:11)
And I call that the cult of uncertainty. That’s a phase that customer’s in. The next is they’re going to get into alignment. So they get into this cult of alignment. They’re starting to understand what the company’s about. And by the way, B2B, B2C doesn’t matter. It’s, I want to understand who it is I’m dealing with, what they’re promising me. Okay, I get it. Now I need to experience it. And as I experience it, hopefully I’ll like it and it’s a good experience and I like that experience, but it’s not predictable yet. It only becomes predictable when it’s repeated, when I can count on it. So you go from uncertainty to alignment to experience, and then you go to ownership. That’s when it is predictable. People say things like, “they’re always so helpful, they always get back to me, they always are friendly.” Yeah, the word “always” followed by something good.

Shep Hyken: (08:57)
Now, if it is positive and it’s predictable and consistent, you’re actually operating into the ultimate cult, the cult of amazement. And that’s where, and by the way, amazement can be over the top, blow me away. But you can’t count on over the top experiences every time. Usually, you have to wait for a problem to fix it. Or maybe you overhear something and you can surprise someone. But if day in and day out, you’re just predictably above average and creating that positive experience where your customers go, “I love doing business with them.” And if you said, well, what do you like about them? They always get back to me so quickly. They’re always, like I said, knowledgeable, helpful, friendly. You can use all those. Even when there’s a problem, I know I can always count on them. Which by the way, when you’re in amazement and then there’s a problem, that customer immediately goes back to uncertainty. Immediately. And if you handle it right, they quickly jump back to amazement. And that’s when they’ll say, even when there’s a problem, I know I can, here’s that word, always count on them. So that word “always” followed by something positive.

Gabe Larsen: (10:01)
But that is scalabil– it’s consistent.

Shep Hyken: (10:06)
Consistency counts. I would say that as I do my speeches, I don’t know how many, I mean I’ve done thousands of them over the years, but, as I’ve been talking about consistency; I’ve been talking about consistency since the 80s. No matter how good you are, if you’re one day good and the next day, okay, even if you ever dropped below average, you’re still going to be seen as inconsistent. So if on a scale of one to five where one is bad and five is great, three is average or in the middle. To be better than average means simply that Horst Schulze, the cofounder and first president of the Ritz Carlton Hotel Organization said, if you want to create a world class brand recognized for amazing service, just be 10% better than average all the time. Because that “all the time” part that’s not easy to do.

Gabe Larsen: (10:57)
Yeah, but that’s interesting because we do — sometimes we celebrate the crazy stuff, right? The over the top, I think is the word you used. And those are nice, but it does require maybe a big blow up or a big problem. It’s that consistent, repeatable, scalable, whatever other word you want to throw in, that 10% above average. But it’s getting there. That ain’t that easy.

Shep Hyken: (11:20)
Well over the top is hard. I mean, you know, it’s like if you’re a server at a restaurant and you overhear a couple talking that it’s their year anniversary and you surprise them with a cake with a candle. That’s not really over the top, but that’s a surprise. Okay. But if the rest of the time you are inattentive and didn’t bring them their drinks fast and the food came out and it was sloppy the way it was, put–. See, you’ve got to always be — I want them to say, “you know what, that server was wonderful and that surprise was amazing.” And wonderful is attentive, friendly, nice, made suggestions. And that’s a very simple hospitality example. But again, B2B, it’s the same way. We’re a manufacturer. We’re selling to a company. You feel good about the order you place. I call you up and say, just want to let you know the order– or I email you– the order has shipped, here’s tracking information. I’m going to watch it too. I call you to let you know it arrived and, or I email you to let you know, and I’m on top of it. And you’re saying to yourself, wow, these people have it together. And when that happens again and again you go, “I can always count on them.”

Shep Hyken: (12:29)
That’s why people love Amazon. It’s because they send out these notices, your order is placed, your order has shipped, your order is received. Then on top of that, if there’s a problem, they have a pretty great system of management.

Gabe Larsen: (12:42)
I want to get through the rest of the phases, but just one more click on that because that’s like the Holy Grail. That consistency. It just seems like we can’t do it. Is it because we don’t have the technology, the wherewithal, the knowledge, that there’s just too many complications? How come we’re not there?

Shep Hyken: (12:59)
I believe that the majority of the problem with inconsistency, sure there are issues built into a process that can be fixed. But a lot of the problems have to do with people where they’re not paying attention to what’s going on in that moment. And I will tell you when I work with clients and one of the exercises we’ll do is say, I want to have the group sit down in small groups and talk about– come up with the three biggest problems you hear customers complain about all the time. And I love this because they come up with some great ones and I go, all right, let’s figure out what the most important one we want to deal with. So this happens all the time. Oh yeah, it happens every week, every day. I go, well, if it’s happening all the time, why haven’t you fixed it yet? Okay. And by the way, some things are not fixable. Jeff Bezos said, we don’t need a customer service department. We need to be that good that customers should never need to call us for anything. And that worked until the shipment went out of the warehouse and then UPS, FedEx, Post Office, whoever it is, picked it up and lost it on the way. Now, it wasn’t in Amazon’s hands. It isn’t even Amazon’s fault. By the way, every time a customer called and said, where’s my shipment? It didn’t get here. And they found out that it was lost by UPS, FedEx, or Post Office, whoever. Amazon always said, no problem. We’ll take care of you. Okay. And see, that’s the kind of thing that kind of started that consistency of ownership. And whenever there’s a problem, I always say, apologize, acknowledge or acknowledge and apologize, doesn’t matter. Fix it. That’s the third step. Acknowledge, apologize, fix it or discuss what you’re going to do. Take ownership of it. Don’t blame others, just get it done. And number five, do it fast. And when you do that, you’re going to restore confidence. Now, even though a shipment that’s lost isn’t Amazon’s fault, how quickly they say, we’re going to get one out to you right away.

Gabe Larsen: (14:52)
They take ownership and they recognize it. You know, it’s funny, I remember one time, just to be thinking of your example when you talked to your group. I started even new at this company, but it’s funny when you have fresh eyes on a perspective problem. I remember I joined this company right in the front door, there was this big orange cord that kind of went across the front of the office. And I remember walking in and thinking, guys, why is this orange cord here, this large orange cord? Every day we have this step over it. And you know, to a point, it’s like, well, it’s just always been there. [inaudible]. So sometimes we don’t even acknowledge it because it has become just what we deal with. The orange cord is in our way. It’s always there.

Shep Hyken: (15:39)
There’s an old story. Zig Ziglar, the famous motivational speaker who’s passed away, used to tell a story about — there’s a big family dinner and the little girl says, “mommy, why do you cut the end of the roast off before you put it in the oven?” And mom thought about it and she says, well, that’s what your grandma taught me. And so she went to grandma, “grandma, why do we cut the end off the roast before we put it in the oven?” And she goes, “well that’s actually, that’s a very good question. But when I learned how to cook a roast, that’s the way I was taught by your great grandma.” Great grandma, four generations is in the room. She goes over to this elderly woman, “great Grammy, why do you cut the end of the road off before you put it in the oven?” And she said, because those roasts are so big, you have to take the end off so it will fit in the oven.” But the oven has got bigger, but they still kept cutting the end of the roast off. And it’s like, because we always did it that way and sometimes we become so used to something that it just doesn’t phase us. So back to the original concept, when our clients say this happens all the time ago, why is it happening all the time? There’s got to be some way to eliminate or at least mitigate it. So anyway, we have digressed away from the five columns.

Gabe Larsen: (16:54)
I’m so sorry, that’s so fun.

Shep Hyken: (16:56)
Oh I love it. This is what happens.

Gabe Larsen: (17:00)
[inaudible]. Oh man, you’re right. Bless his soul because that was a lot of great quotes. So go ahead and finish the five. I did have one other question.

Shep Hyken: (17:06)
Those are the five. We’ve got uncertainty into alignment, into experience, ownership and then amazement. And by the way, you mentioned Gabe, as you walked into a new company, employees have the same exact experiences that customers have, the five phases or five calls. Because when you walked in to work with, you know, this new company Kustomer, which by the way, I love the way they spell it. Different. Okay. Because whoever said — there is truth to this, that spelling is no indication of intelligence. Okay.

Gabe Larsen: (17:41)
No comment.

Shep Hyken: (17:43)
Very smart people just don’t know how to spell. Okay. You spell by remembering, by feeling it and kinesiology. I don’t know. There’s all kinds of ways they talk about, anyway.

Gabe Larsen: (17:53)
He’s mocking because we spell it with a K. For those of you who don’t know Customer with a K.

Shep Hyken: (17:57)
Is the K backwards? No, it’s Customer with the K. So, here’s the thing. The employee comes in and they go, Oh, I’m looking forward to work. I hope I love this job. Hope. Hope is not a strategy as they say, but hope is also an indication of uncertainty. Now I’m in there, I’m being onboarded, I’m learning about the mission, the values, the vision. Now I’m getting into alignment. I’m understanding it. So now I’m going to go to work. I understand this is what we’re supposed to do, this is how we’re supposed to be, and now I’m experiencing this and hopefully I’m liking it. By the way, I’m assuming that I’m enjoying this experience. Can’t wait for tomorrow. Oh, more of the same, more of the same every day. Now I’m owning it. And when you say to me, how do you like your job when you come home and your partner, your spouse, your best friend says, how do you like your new job? And you say, I love working there. You’ve now moved that employee from hope or uncertainty into amazement.

Gabe Larsen: (18:56)
Wow. Yeah. So, the employee’s journey does follow those same things, those five phases or five cults. Got it. One thing I wanted to dive into on the five, you talked just a little about the employee side of it, but we were talking about consistency. Is it– how possible is it really? I mean, you’ve been doing this for 37 years Shep, so you can just tell me it’s not possible, but is it really possible to get to that amazing level? I mean, can you be that?

Shep Hyken: (19:22)
Yeah, that’s the whole point. That’s what I try to preach to my clients. And by the way, I have lost a couple of speeches and projects because my definition of amazement is better than average all the time. And, there was a client that said, we need to always be, we need to blow our clients away every time. We need to prove to them over and over again. I go, you prove it when you’re consistently better than average. And by the way, the client defines who and what average is, but you can get a pretty good idea after being in business for a while, what your clients basic expectations are, and then say, where can I make it better? Where can I exceed it? I don’t ever want my client — you could say this, or Kustomer, you can create standards. You could say our clients will never be on hold for more than 45 seconds and if they are on hold, they’ll be given the option, by technology, allowing us to tell the client, “your call really is important in spite of what other people say and we value your time. We unfortunately are overwhelmed today and your whole time will be about four minutes or we can call you back at whatever time is convenient.” And you know, there’s a system that allows them to just punch in the numbers on their keypad and that shows you appreciate their time and effort. I can’t stand calling and they say it’s very busy, please hold, forever. We don’t know how long it’s going to take. So anyway, there is an example.

Gabe Larsen: (20:50)
We almost don’t even put up with that anymore. Now that we know there’s a different option, right? So, I love that definition of amazing, by the way. It just makes it so much more obtainable. That that does makes me feel better.

Shep Hyken: (21:01)
Little better than average all the time. And that means, and you can set your standards and you could say you’ll always return a phone call within two hours. You’ll always return an email within whenever. And you create these standards and you know, these standards are not just acceptable, but they will impress your customers. And you do that by talking to your people about what they know impresses their customers both internally and externally. We do an exercise here, in our office — and we teach our clients all over the world to do this — where every week they have to bring in an example of a good experience that they’ve created either for an internal or external customer. Sometimes it’s just, give me a general customer service moment of magic, positive thing again or give me an example of when you did something very specific that we’re talking about and they have to look to find that example. And what will happen is they’ll make that example happen, which is great because now they’re service aware, they’re making an effort to make things happen, so it’s positive. By the way, the types of exercises we’re talking about are included in the book. At the end we have a whole workbook and these are the same exercises that our trainers from our company go out and deliver to companies all over the world, so it’s included as part of the book.

Gabe Larsen: (22:15)
Let’s get there. I mean we’ve hit on a couple of points. I love some of the action items. If someone wants to learn more about you — get into the book. We’re obviously recording it now. It will be hopefully releasing soon here in conjunction with this session. What would you recommend to take the next step and learn more about Shep Hyken and what he does?

Shep Hyken: (22:35)
Well, you can go to hyken.com but if you want to learn more about the book, cultofthecustomer.com, and you can learn more or go straight to Amazon. By the way, if you buy the book, you need to go back to the website and there is, you’ll see it as you scroll down– I’m looking at it now– a big circle with a star in it says if you already pre-purchase a book, click here for your free gift. But you know what, we are going to modify the free gift just a little and let me tell you what we’re giving away. Anybody that clicks on that will get free access to one of my courses. We charge $49 for this course. It’s an online service course. Here’s what I want people to do. You can look at it as an individual. Print the workbook out, fine. If you’ve got a group of 25 people, print out 25 workbooks. It’s your paper at that point, and show it to everybody. You’ll have a great one hour with a group of people — have an hour long customer service workshop that you’ll be able to do with your group. No charge. Once you get it, you’ve got to use it because it’s not going to be there forever.

Gabe Larsen: (23:40)
Got it. Oh I love it.

Shep Hyken: (23:41)
cultofthecustomer.com.

Gabe Larsen: (23:43)
Cult of the Customer. Um, make sure we get that. Shep best of luck. Again, sounds like the book, the new version of the book, obviously it’s been out for a while, but new version with new stories, nobody from jail, et cetera.

Shep Hyken: (23:56)
It’s crazy. Yeah. And if I won’t tell you — if you read through the book you’ll go “Oh I know this is.”

Gabe Larsen: (24:02)
I probably don’t. Well, I really appreciate you taking the time. A great talk track on the Cult of the Customer. So again, appreciate you taking a minute for the audience. Have a fantastic day.

Shep Hyken: (24:14)
Thanks Gabe, thanks for having me. Bye bye.

Gabe Larsen: (24:16)
Bye bye. Alrighty and that is a wrap.

Exit Voice: (24:29)
Thank you for listening. Make sure you subscribe to hear more customer service secrets.

 

3 Reasons You Need Customer Sentiment Analysis

woman on phone sitting on steps

A common saying states that perception is reality. Regardless of its validity, perception is widely accepted, and it can have significant consequences on either an individual or an organization’s reputation and credibility.

Organizations face this every day: how to deliver the best possible product while also winning trust through superb service. Even a superior product can fall victim to upset customers — according to an Accenture Strategy Research Report, 47% of consumers admit they won’t even engage with a brand after being disappointed. Today’s complex, omnichannel environment makes these stakes even higher.

Analyzing sentiment and empowering agents with data allows them to go above and beyond, providing customers with an experience that promotes not only satisfaction, but also encourages loyalty.

What is Customer Sentiment Analysis?

KM World defines customer sentiment analysis as the processing of information to determine the opinion of a consumer. The time consumers take to ask questions, resolve issues, and share both positive and negative experiences can be used to help an organization evolve.

It’s important to understand that the way this information is gathered has changed drastically in the last two decades. What was once handled by either a letter or phone call to a company has now evolved into a multi-layered approach that can feel dizzying for an organization seeking to keep pace.

To deliver the most empathetic customer service experience, an organization must understand customer sentiment across all channels. Let’s take a closer look at sentiment scoring, what’s considered a positive sentiment and three solid reasons customer sentiment analysis is a must for your organization.

What is a Sentiment Score?

According to CallMiner, a sentiment score is the number used to gauge customers’ opinions of a company’s service and products. A positive sentiment score indicates exactly what it describes — customers are satisfied with their experience with the company’s offerings and will likely continue to go about business as usual — and as such, a negative score explains the opposite. Both types of sentiment scoring are important, as they can help a company understand where they need to improve and where they can continue following business protocol.

3 Reasons You Need Customer Sentiment Analysis

Sentiment analysis gives you an increasingly accurate temperature check on how your customers feel about your brand, your products and the service you provide. For agents to turn this data into insights, however, they must be able to easily access this type of customer information.

Here are three reasons why customer sentiment analysis is ideal for driving customer loyalty:

1. Customer Service Agents Become Advocates

Every time a customer reaches an agent, that agent should, at a minimum, be empowered with all the information needed to provide a seamless experience. From purchase information, shipping information, and return requests, to an accumulation of all internal communications that have occurred, agents should have all the customer details available to them in order to provide the best possible service. But this isn’t always possible without the right technology.

When armed with sentiment analysis, the agent is properly prepared to connect and empathize with the customer on the aspects of either the service or the product that felt frustrating. This type of communication serves to both personalize the experience while also helping to neutralize potentially difficult conversations.

To provide the modern experience customers expect, organizations can’t afford for their agents to have any information gaps. According to Calabrio, 60% of customer service agents feel that they don’t have the tools or technology needed to handle customer issues, and 34% cite a lack of pertinent customer data as their biggest problem. With the right resources in place, companies can properly identify negative and positive sentiment scores and translate the insights into providing an improved customer experience across the board.

2. It Has a Major Influence on the Future of Your Business

When it comes to both acquiring and retaining customers, brands must pursue the new rules of engagement. According to Social Media Today, 70% of consumers have admitted that they turned to the social media accounts of brands for customer service reasons on one occasion or more. Utilizing social media channels is one of the most advantageous moves a brand can make today.

Customer interactions, whether indicating negative or positive sentiment, can be used to benefit the company. This data can be used to get ahead of issues, inform internal product teams of concerns or problems and influence both new customers and loyal ones. Data can reveal how an individual consumer is feeling, and it can also reveal areas in your product or policies that need improvement.

3. Customer Experience Gaps Vanish (With Holistic Measurement)

Unfortunately, many organizations look at sentiment based on the channel: e-mail, phone, chatbot/live chat, social and others, and that means all the data collected is siloed. The result of siloed data needing to be measured and analyzed together is an analyst somewhere banging their heads against a wall trying to fit a square peg through a round hole.

In other words, siloed data can be analyzed together, but it will usually be inconsistent and incomplete, with gaps that don’t cover the holistic customer experience. When attempting to make sense of the entire customer journey from initial awareness through to repeat purchases, organizations must consider a holistic way of collecting the data to be analyzed more accurately. A customer service CRM platform, that unifies all data into a single view, can help businesses garner insights from cross-channel data.

How Kustomer can help

Understanding how your customers feel can be a useful tool for your business. The organization that achieves a comprehensive, holistic and actionable view of their customer, and leverages sentiment analysis to understand how customers are feeling, can create empathetic experiences that boost loyalty, retention and repeat sales.

Kustomer’s Sentiment Engine specifically achieves this. It’s driven by AWS Amazon Comprehend, and through natural language processing APIs, the Kustomer platform can analyze all incoming text from the customer, no matter the channel. You’ll always know how they feel, and be prepared to deliver exceptional service in customers’ greatest times of need.

If you’re ready to transform your organization’s customer service into one that drives loyalty in the modern age, click here for three ways to get started.

 

What is Punk CX and Why Should You Care with Adrian Swinscoe

What is Punk CX and Why Should You Care with Adrian Swinscoe TW

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In this episode of Customer Service Secrets, Adrian Swinscoe joins Gabe Larsen to discuss his philosophies and strategies for improving the customer service experience. For the last 25 years, Adrian has been consulting individuals and companies on their marketing and business development, customer insight, and customer service spaces. He has a passion for helping businesses create positive spaces for their customers and helping organizations simplify their strategies to make them more effective. Adrian is also the author of How to Wow and Punk CX, the latter being one of the subjects of discussion in this episode of the podcast. Listen to the full episode below.

What is Punk CX?

Punk CX is a new way of looking at customer service that Adrian thought of back in 2017. He was inspired by the emergence of punk music in stark contrast to the prog-rock era of the 1970s, at which time punk music became a statement to go against the norm. The creators of punk saw prog rock as becoming too measured and overly technical, and Adrian sees a lot of similarities in the customer experience space. Adrian believes that companies were getting too meticulous with their strategies. When instead, they needed to develop more of a punk mindset. Adrian describes this mindset by stating, “It was a very DIY, democratic, back to basics approach. It was more about mindset and daring to be different and being okay that not everybody would like it.” If companies can drop the technicalities and start committing to action-based solutions in their customer service, they will have a greater capacity to help their customers and grow their business.

Connecting Strategy with Business Objectives

To illustrate this point, Adrian shares an interesting story about the interviews he has had with business executives. First, when executives are asked what their customer service strategies are, they repeat all the typical buzzwords; such as omnichannel, effortless, digital, connected, etc. – all responding in similar ways. When asked follow up questions, their answers are even more vague. Adrian recalls, “the second question I say is . . . tell me how your strategy supports and enables the delivery of the overall business’s strategy and overall business’s objectives. And then you get some blank faces.” Overly technical customer service strategy does nothing for the business or the customer if they aren’t aligned with the business objectives. Too many organizations are draining resources on little details that aren’t connected to their business or customers. By simplifying strategies and connecting strategy and objectives, organizations will find their business growing and their customers happier and more satisfied.

How to Simplify and Amplify the Customer Service Experience

Most organizations aren’t listening to the feedback their customers give them and it’s hurting their business. Adrian quotes a study that states “only 20% of them [companies] have actually delivered and developed the resources, the content, the knowledge bases, the facilities and the tools to help customers help themselves.” While most companies know that their customers want to help themselves and don’t want to jump through the customer service hoops, they aren’t investing in finding solutions. Adrian’s recommendation for organizations to simplify and amplify the customer experience is to do the necessary research and start implementing it.

The next challenge for companies to develop punk CX is to keep evolving with their consumers. In a remarkable comment about the true nature of customer service and the need to have a punk attitude about it, Adrian explains:

“People’s queries and inquiries and problems and their questions, they change and evolve over time. So that content needs to be managed and maintained and upgraded on a consistent basis. And so, you need to make an ongoing investment in that if you want to keep ahead of that curve. Because absolutely guaranteed, your products, your services will evolve and therefore the problems or the questions or the queries that your customers will have will evolve as well.”

By researching and continually investing in the customer experience, companies will stay ahead of the curve and give the consumers exactly what they want, the means and tools to help themselves.

To learn more about punk customer experience strategies, check out the Customer Service Secrets podcast episode, and be sure to subscribe for new episodes each Thursday.

 

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Full Episode Transcript:

What is Punk CX and Why Should You Care | Adrian Swinscoe

Into Voice (00:04):
You’re listening to the Customer Service Secrets Podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen (00:11):
Alight, welcome everybody to today’s podcast. We’re going to be talking about a little different perspective on how you should be looking at customer service. And to do that, we brought in Adrian Swinscoe. He’s actually the author of a couple books. One that I’ve come across is How to Wow and we’ll be talking a little bit about that today. Then, there is actually another one that came across; we were talking a little bit pre-show, it’s called Punk CX and we’re going to start with that one. He does run his own show at Adrianswinscoe.com. But I’m excited to have you on the show Adrian. How are you?

Adrian Swinscoe (00:49):
I’m great Gabe and nice to see you. Nice to speak to you. Nice to be on your show. Thanks for the invite.

Gabe Larsen (00:56):
Yeah, it’s been refreshing. Again, I did just kind of stumble across Adrian if I’m honest, and I liked some of his content, so I wanted to interview him for this podcast. But this “punk CX” thing definitely jumped out so I want to dive into it. But, before we do Adrian, can you tell us a little about yourself and kind of your background?

Adrian Swinscoe (01:15):
Okay. So quickly, I work in this service experience sort of space and have been in this sort of space for, crumbs, probably somewhere in the region of 11 or 12 years. I’ve been, I have a background as an economist, a teacher, I worked as a business developer in a corporate environment doing an innovation related sort of projects, worked as a general, sort of like a freelance, independent consultant. Nearly bought a steel company at one point. So I nearly became a steel magnet, which was a near miss. Unfortunately, I wanted to be able to wander around with a big hat and a cigar, but that’s obviously in a parallel universe. But right now, I am in this sort of space. My, I describe myself as a lover of simplicity and the human touch with a really useful bit of technology thrown in. And the thing that I really am interested in, and focus on, is how do we build organizations that deliver better outcomes for both their customers and their people.

Gabe Larsen (02:27):
Yeah, yeah. I love it. Great introduction. I’m sorry to hear about the steel mill. Maybe in a future life to your point you will be able to do that.

Adrian Swinscoe (02:36):
You’ll see me on a sidewalk somewhere kind of like smoking a big fat cigar.

Gabe Larsen (02:41):
I’m just not picturing it, but it’ll take me a little time. I’ll get there. So let’s dive into this. That was a great kind of intro of you. I was a little bit taken back as you were talking about this thing of “punk CX.” I was like, Whoa, that feels, truthfully different than I think a lot of people have framed it. Give me kind of the why, what, how. Why “punk CX,” and what does it mean?

Adrian Swinscoe (03:05):
So I’ll give you the short, I mean, I will try and make it as short as possible. About, back in December, 2017, you know, as is my one from time to time, I was in the pub with my friend O’Sheen drinking a couple of pints of Guinness and I was having a bit of a rant about the state of the experience and service and experience sort of space. And I was getting frustrated by the idea that we weren’t seeing really significant material kind of changes in the experience that one; companies were delivering, and two; that their customers were getting. And I was almost a bit like banging on the table, just, I wish some people would do something a bit more punk. And when I say punk I don’t mean the green hair and piercings and kind of like destruction and loud music and raging at people.

Gabe Larsen (03:58):
Right, right.

Adrian Swinscoe (03:59):
I mean, just doing something which dares to be different. It’s a little bit kind of stand out from the crowd, that’s a bit more experimental, that is a bit of a bit of a change. That idea sat with me for about six months and in the summer of 2018 I started to think about it, started to think about that a bit more deeply. And it made me think about where does, where did punk come from? Now punk came, exploded out of the back of prog-rock in the 1970s. Now prog-rock, for anybody that is a music fan, it was popular. It was also accused of being overly elaborate, somewhat self-indulgent, kind of overly technical. You almost needed a PhD in music to be able to be part of a prog-rock band. In some respects, and in danger of disappearing up its own arse — i.e. it was more interested than it was, maybe, in its fans.

Gabe Larsen (04:59):
I love it.

Adrian Swinscoe (05:00):
And then punk exploded out of the back of that with this idea of like going, well anybody can make music. And it was a very DIY democratic, back to basics approach. It was more about mindset and daring to be different and being okay that not everybody would like it. And I thought that’s cool, but then I thought, you know what’s funny, it’s like the service and experience space I think is starting to exhibit some of the same characteristics as prog-rock did in the 1970s — i.e. It’s becoming overly specialized, functionalized, measured, certified, professionalized, blah, blah blah, yada, yada, yada. All that sort of stuff.

Gabe Larsen (05:37):
It’s over complicated. Yeah, over complicated so many things. Got it.

Adrian Swinscoe (05:40):
And also get into the same point where it’s becoming more interested in itself then actually the people that are supposed to benefit from it — i.e. our customers. And that sort of explains a lot of the lack of real movement and improvement in this whole space, particularly for employees and customers.

Gabe Larsen (05:56):
Got it.

Adrian Swinscoe (05:58):
And I thought, well, if that’s true, then what would a punk version of CX look like? And I was a bit like, that’s cool. Well let me figure something out. And then, what it spoke to was this idea of like trying to inject a bit of urgency, a call to action into the experience space to say, stop over complicating things. Stop, get out from behind your desk and your spreadsheets and your dashboards and all these different sort of things and do stuff that really matters to your customers.

Gabe Larsen (06:34):
Right.

Adrian Swinscoe (06:34):
And so I wrote the book, it’s more like a fanzine or a manifesto. I call it a visual slap in the face for the customer experience industry because it’s not like any other business book in that it’s not 50,000 words of black ink on white paper. It’s like a full color, short pithy to the point. It’s almost designed like an album and that rather than having chapters, I talk about having a track listing. So you end up with this, here’s a title, here’s a few short words that kind of basically makes the point and then ask a couple of questions or maybe just makes a point that says, right, now crack on, get on with it. I’m more interested in better action that produces better results. That’s it.

Gabe Larsen (07:17):
Yeah, yeah. It does seem like I’m still newer to the space. Your point on just kind of a lot of talk, a lot of over complication and just this idea when you kind of deuce it to me, you know, let’s simplify, let’s focus on what matters most. And I mean, again, some of the other things on the outsider, they’re important, but they’re not as important as what the goal of this whole function is; that is obviously to make the customer’s life easier and better. So, as you’ve kind of taken that idea of “punk CX,” I assume you’ve probably seen this in different areas, you’ve consulted different companies. Let’s go into the, not necessarily the tactical, but how would you start thinking about some ways to clear that crap out and just simplify CX or the experience that customers are having with different brands?

Adrian Swinscoe (08:12):
So one of the things I would say, where I would really start, cause you can get a little tactical and you start fiddling around in different sort of things. I think the one thing I would say is that, I think we actually have to start fundamentally at a strategic kind of level. Okay. And the thing that strikes me, and this is where we’re, I think we’re getting caught, it’s creating a lot of problems, is that — I’ve met a bunch of people and particularly leaders, directors, managers in this sort of space. You turn around to them and go, right, fine. I want to ask you a couple of questions. And the first question is, what’s your experience strategy? And they go, right, okay. And they go, we want to create an effortless, digital, connected, omnichannel, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Gabe Larsen (09:02):
Buzzword, buzzword, buzzword,

Adrian Swinscoe (09:04):
Experience. And then it goes like, you’ve got a room of like 50 people and pretty much everybody’s saying the same thing, right? And you go, brilliant, okay, thank you for that. I’m not going to make you wrong just yet, but I will thank you for your answers. And then the second question I say is go, okay, now, tell me how your strategy supports and enables the delivery of the overall business’s strategy and overall business’s objectives. And then you get some blank faces.

Gabe Larsen (09:39):
You get some blanks. Yeah, I can see that.

Adrian Swinscoe (09:42):
And then you end up with this kind of thing with people, and then you’ve got blank faces and then you get some twinges of panic and nervous twitches and stuff going on because people know. Then they’re kind of like, oh, okay. It feels really obvious, but actually that’s the thing. If you’re not connected to what the business is going to really do, then — in time, and I think that time is actually starting, is coming right now, is that people start to challenge the worth of what you’re doing and why you’re doing it. Right? So that’s one of the big questions is because what we’ve seen is this proliferation of activity, whether it’s like this or that or the other; I don’t want to name and shame any particular areas.

Gabe Larsen (10:32):
Right, right.

Adrian Swinscoe (10:32):
But yet out of all this explosion of activity, you got to look at it and go, yeah, but none of it’s all connected. None of it makes sense. None of it is driving positive changes and outcomes that make a difference to the business and therefore make a difference to customers.

Gabe Larsen (10:48):
Yeah. So, one is that idea that we get so caught up in the minutia sometimes, we need to make sure that we are strategically aligning with what the business wants.

Adrian Swinscoe (10:59):
Exactly.

Gabe Larsen (11:03):
It’s simple but it’s true.

Adrian Swinscoe (11:04):
I know, completely. It’s a bit like, you have to be measured and considerate and everything that you can do because ultimately, it’s about delivering value for both the business and the customers.

Gabe Larsen (11:15):
Yeah.

Adrian Swinscoe (11:16):
It’s not about what you want to do. It’s about what is required.

Gabe Larsen (11:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Adrian Swinscoe (11:22):
And right now we’ve got this elaborate, nest of things; many of which don’t make any sense. So it just feels an expensive mess if you’re an exec — a C level executive looking down at this and going, we’re spending all this money, what are we getting?

Gabe Larsen (11:36):
What are we actually getting?

Adrian Swinscoe (11:38):
And I am kind of getting letters and emails and tweets and all this stuff coming from customers going, what the? I’m spending all this money and I’m trying really hard and they’re still bombarding me with all this crap.

Gabe Larsen (11:54):
All this kind of nonsense. Right? Yeah. Because it just doesn’t work for the customer ultimately. Got it. Got it. So, one is strategy. The other thing I wanted you to kind of click into, you and I talked about this a little pre show, but there was some research you came across and it did feel like another one of those points that was like, duh! Why don’t we do the simple stuff versus making the complicated stuff you want to touch on that briefly?

Adrian Swinscoe (12:18):
Yeah. So, one of the big things that really, really frustrates me is this idea that we know that customers don’t really want to get in touch with us, they don’t really enjoy the idea of the prospect of having to phone and then navigate a phone tree, or send an email and wait for a response, to do all that sort of stuff. So, if you have a problem that you think is a reasonably simple problem, we like to help ourselves. Right? So even my mom and dad who are in their seventies will probably like to do some research and figure out how to do something, try to figure out how to do something first before we try and involve somebody else. Now, the interesting thing is that there’s some research that says that somewhere in the region of 60%, if not more, of all inquiries into help desk, support teams, contact centers, whatever, come about for two reasons. One is that your customers can’t find what they’re looking for on your website or you’ve just failed to answer their question the first time around and you sort of messed it up. So you’ve got this kind of 60% of your inbound demand for help can be solved either by you being better at solving things the first time around, or two, helping customers help themselves. Interestingly, Zendesk, who is one of your competitors, so asked for permission to talk about this beforehand, they produce a piece of research, which said something in the region like 50% of all companies, north of 50% of all companies know this, they understand this, yet only 20% of them have actually delivered and developed the resources, the content, the knowledge bases, the facilities and the tools to help customers help themselves.

Gabe Larsen (14:15):
Yeah.

Adrian Swinscoe (14:15):
And I’m going, my mind is exploding here. I’m like, good people. Listen to your customers, hear what they’re saying and do the bloody work.

Gabe Larsen (14:23):
Yeah.

Adrian Swinscoe (14:25):
Cause I’ll tell you what, it will make your life easier.

Gabe Larsen (14:28):
Yeah. Yeah. What do we — I mean I love the point because again, I think that’s kind of that, it’s just the simplicity of CX. We get caught up in all the things. Would you say — that 20% number, give or take, it’s very interesting. Well, why don’t we? This does drive back to this “punk CX” thing. We just, we get caught up in all the minutia and we lose that simplicity. That’s the whole point.

Adrian Swinscoe (14:53):
I think the thing that is, that’s part of it. I think there’s also the other part of it is that it requires us to do different things.

Gabe Larsen (15:00):
Yeah.

Adrian Swinscoe (15:01):
And the different things include being able to develop, manage, and maintain content that responds to our understanding of what customers want.

Gabe Larsen (15:18):
Yeah.

Adrian Swinscoe (15:19):
Naturally, an organization will look and go, well, developing content requires people with different skills. Whether it’s the data analysis and listening skills and then the producing of the content and the quality management and the digital uploading and thereof et cetera, et cetera. But, that requires people and that requires a cost.

Gabe Larsen (15:46):
Yeah.

Adrian Swinscoe (15:46):
Right. And what they’ve got to do is they’ve got to try and manage off. We’re making an investment here in terms of the development thereof of that content against how much we’re going to save on the inbound inquiries, right? And you’ve got to get that balance. Now, the trap that people fall into is they’ll go, Ooh, we’ll develop that content and then that demand is going to disappear. I’m like, no! Because here’s the thing, people’s queries and inquiries and problems and their questions, they change and evolve over time.

Gabe Larsen (16:20):
Right, right.

Adrian Swinscoe (16:20):
So that content needs to be managed and maintained and upgraded on a consistent basis. And so, you need to make an ongoing investment in that if you want to keep ahead of that curve. Because absolutely guaranteed, your products, your services will evolve and therefore the problems or the questions or the queries that your customers will have will evolve as well.

Gabe Larsen (16:48):
I love it.

Adrian Swinscoe (16:48):
And so if you’re not developing that knowledge consistently, this demand here, this inbound query demand may go down a little bit, but it may spring back up again as you do a new product launch. It’s an ongoing investment. You’ve got to try and get that balance there.

Gabe Larsen (17:06):
And people just really struggle finding that balance. That’s a really interesting insight. I liked that. I liked that a lot. Well Adrian, man, there’s always more to discuss, always more to go through. We didn’t even get to the, to the 60, what is it, 63 principles in the “Wow” book.

Adrian Swinscoe (17:23):
68 in fact.

Gabe Larsen (17:24):
68.

Adrian Swinscoe (17:25):
I did want it to be 69, but my publisher wouldn’t let me go there.

Gabe Larsen (17:31):
That’s a great way to end this show. We may have to bring you back to dive into maybe not 69, but a couple of these, “How to Wow” customers going forward. But I do appreciate you jumping on. If someone wants to learn a little bit more about you and understand more about Adrian Swinscoe, where should they go?

Adrian Swinscoe (17:49):
Just going to look me up on Adrianswinscoe.com , Which is A D R I A N S W I N S C O E.com. You’ll find everything you need over there.

Gabe Larsen (18:00):
Well, again, really appreciate it, I love the simplicity message. I think it’s something we need. So thanks for taking the time and for the audience, Have a fantastic day.

Adrian Swinscoe (18:08):
Dude, thanks Gabe.

Exit Voice (18:16):
Thank you for listening. Make sure you subscribe to hear more customer service secrets.

 

The Five Key Elements that Drive Customer Experience with Mary Drummond

The Five Key Elements that Drive Customer Satisfaction with Mary Drummond TW 2

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Mary Drummond, CMO of Worthix, a specialist at improving customer experiences, joins Gabe Larsen on the Customer Service Secrets podcast to discuss the fundamental elements of building beneficial relationships between companies and customers.

The Value Of Time Well Spent

Mary shares an experience she had during a podcast interview with Joe Pine, the decorated author of the book The Experience Economy. As they discussed customer experience, Joe said, “Mary, when people talk about customer experience, they’re talking about something entirely different than what I’m talking about.” When most people talk about customer experience, they’re actually referring to customer service, customer satisfaction, customer relationship, customer success. However, Joe’s understanding of customer experience is centered on the value of “time well spent”. Mary adds to this point, stating, “it’s taking your time to create an experience out of that purchase.” From this perspective, customer experience can be seen in terms of the economic offering of an experience.

Starting With The Customer’s Needs

In order to create these experiences, one of the best starting points is by going through the process of identifying the customer’s needs and expectations. While the advancement of innovation and technology are continually changing the ways in which expectations are expressed, many of the fundamental needs remain the same. Mary shares an example of the basic need of transportation to convey this point. Before the invention of cars, people still needed to get around, but they either walked, rode a bicycle, or used horses to do so. “Now, as value propositions changed, innovation and technology came around. That need was exactly the same, but the expectations of the market started changing. And as the expectations changed, companies adapted to this ever-changing speed of the customer and provided more and more innovation in the form of automobiles.” As a result, Mary claims that it is the company’s job to identify “the need of the customer according to their ever-changing expectations.”

Building on this, the customer’s experience is established through each of the interactions they have with a company. However, these interactions aren’t limited to the moment of purchase, which is the way many companies see it. The interactions customers have with companies and brands begin as soon as they realize their need, and lasts past the point of purchase. In this context, Mary defines the experience as “the sum of the interactions that work together to provide a solution to the need according to the customer’s expectations.”

The Five Drivers of Customer Satisfaction

Mary offers five of the most important drivers that influence purchasing decisions and customer satisfaction. These main determining factors are “price, quality, relationship, social proof, and brand identification.” All of these hold value to some extent when someone is deciding which food to eat, which clothes to wear, or how they are going to spend their day off. “Depending on how they weigh out in a customer’s mind, you can either increase one in order to improve that perception of a good experience, or reduce them in case it’s causing a bad experience.” By examining these drivers and how they impact the customer’s experience, we can get a better idea as to whether the customer views the experience as “time well spent”.

For more ideas on building your customer experience, listen to the Customer Service Secrets episode “The Five Key Elements that Drive Customer Experience” wherever you listen to podcasts.

 

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Full Episode Transcript:

The Five Key Elements that Drive Customer Experience with Mary Drummond

Intro Voice (00:04):
You’re listening to the customer service secrets podcast by Kustomer.

Gabe Larsen (00:10):
All right, welcome everybody to today’s podcast. I’m excited to get going! We’ve got Mary Drummond. She is the CMO at Worthix. Mary, thanks so much for joining, and how are you?

Mary Drummond (00:23):
I’m good. So I’m like your marketing counterpart here at Worthix.

Gabe Larsen (00:26):
That’s right. We’re like marketing partners. I actually hope we are partnering on more stuff. Mary was just giving me a little tour of how to be a podcaster because outside of being the CMO at Worthix, she is also the podcast host of something called the “Voices of CX.” I probably can’t do it justice. Mary, can you tell us a little about yourself, the podcast and what you do over there Worthix?

Mary Drummond (00:51):
So, more than considering myself the chief marketer, I do truly consider myself the chief evangelist. And it’s probably because other than the CEO, you won’t find anyone in this world who is as passionate about this company as I am.

Gabe Larsen (01:08):
We can feel it from your voice, by the way. I’m like feeling the passion.

Mary Drummond (01:12):
I get genuinely excited when I talk about it. Yeah, but it does, it makes my job really, really easy because all I have to do is then take this passion and convert it into something that people can identify with. So, all I have to do is make sure that I’m distributing that message properly, which is why I have the podcast in the first place. Which is a great way to get that message across, to speak to the people in the industry that actually matter, that everybody else is listening to. And it’s been great because honestly, as the host of Voices of Customer Experience or Voices of CX, I have spoken to some of the most brilliant brains that are out there nowadays. And it’s been the biggest learning process of my life for sure.

Gabe Larsen (01:59):
I can only imagine. I can only imagine. I was telling Mary, I’m setting up on my own journey to become a podcast expert, so she might have to be a little bit of a coach and as I do that, but we’ll save that for a later time. Today, we want to jump into some of the trends and problems facing customer service leaders. And one of the things we were talking pre-show that actually was, you know, and I’m being honest here, it was pretty cool was this idea of not looking at it so siloed. A lot of organizations are looking customer experience as just kind of one point. And you kind of blew that up for me and said, Gabe, it’s different. It’s bigger than that. Give me a little more on that. How are you seeing that play out and why is it so important?

Mary Drummond (02:40):
So, I think that the number one problem that we have nowadays is that it’s really difficult for people to agree on a definition of customer experience. It’s just extremely problematic when you think about it. But when people are looking at the experience, there are a lot of definitions out there. The most accepted or the most commonly used one, and it’s the one that’s used by the CXPA, which is the Customer Experience Professional Association, is the idea that experiences are the sum of the interactions that a customer has with a company. Okay, in a nutshell it’s like 20 words, but basically that’s what it is. So, some of the interactions, right? And I agree with that definition, let’s say with some reservation. Now, customer experience has recently become super duper popular. Everybody’s using it. I like to say that customer experience has gone mainstream and you know, it’s gone mainstream when they start using it in advertising. So if you’re going through airports, you’ll see big signs that say, “Try to improve your airport experience.” I’m like, wow, airport experience… Turn on the radio.

Gabe Larsen (03:52):
Airport experience, well yes, there is an experience I guess. That’s weird.

Mary Drummond (03:55):
The bathroom experience when you’re at the airport is a thing too. And they’ll talk, there’s an ad running on the radio from Quicken Loans and it’s talking about improving your mortgage experience. You know, so experiences have really hit mainstream, which is pretty much a dream. I think that there are a lot of people out there, a lot of authors, a lot of thought leaders that really put a lot of work into making this happening, where people actually care, not only people, companies, investors, shareholders, everybody cares about the experience. So that is great. Now it also means that the message gets diluted and it also means that there’s a lot of confusion surrounding what it truly means. And since the industry is new, there’s still a lot of questions. So I understand that my definition of customer experience might not necessarily be same definition as the listener, but hopefully there is an overlap and hopefully what I do for you makes a little bit of sense.

Gabe Larsen (04:58):
Yeah, one quick followup on that, and I’m still kind of a newbie so I can ask this, but is there a big difference between customer experience and customer service? I mean obviously they’re interrelated, but how would you kind of coach people who are like, why are they people acting like those are different? How would you navigate that?

Mary Drummond (05:17):
That’s my favorite question…

Gabe Larsen (05:21):
If it’s too basic, you can be like that’s a dumb question.

Mary Drummond (05:23):
No, I think that it’s the first thing we need to get out of the way. Especially because your company Kustomer works very closely with customer service. And it’s probably one of the biggest focuses, right? We met at Customer Contact World, which is a conference that’s focused on bringing solutions to call centers and customer service. So there is a huge overlap, but it’s an overlap. One is not the same as the other. So as for a definition, I’m going to use what Joe Pine said. So if you know who Joe Pine is, he is the coauthor of a book called The Experience Economy, which was written in 1999. And it was the book that set off the whole idea of customer experience. So he could be called the father of customer experience. He created this whole concept.

Mary Drummond (06:26):
Yeah, and when I had Joe Pine on my podcast, what he told me super clearly was, “Mary, when people talk about customer experience, they’re talking about something entirely different than what I’m talking about.” So most people, when they’re talking about customer experience, they’re actually talking about customer service, customer satisfaction, customer relationship, customer success. What Joe Pine is talking about when he’s discussing the experience is very much the idea of time well spent. So it’s taking your time and creating an experience out of that purchase. So he’s speaking directly to the idea of an economical offering that is an experience.

Gabe Larsen (07:21):
Yeah, that’s deep. My mind… I’m kind of like, ooh… That was deep. So really, customer experience is kind of, I don’t mean to say it’s better, but it’s on top of, right? It’s like it almost, I would almost say, based on what you’re saying is it is, it’s on top of it. There may be that overlap, but it does feel like it is the broader category of some of these subsets like customer service, customer success, etc.

Mary Drummond (07:47):
Well, you see, the thing is that Pine was speaking of the economic offering of an experience. So that would be something like, Candytopia right? Where you offering an experience that people go in there and they have this experiential thing with candy and then you have like the ice cream museum or you have other things like Meow Wolf, this like immersive art. You know, so Pine was speaking specifically of these things, but if you take that concept and you apply it to business, what you understand is the experience boils down to the need. Okay, so way before products or companies or anything else, humans had needs. So if you consider before the automobile was created, people still had the need for transportation. So what were they using at the time? Horses. Bicycles. Whatever. Right, that need, that need existed. And the market was somehow providing that need.

Mary Drummond (08:55):
Now, as value propositions changed, innovation and technology came around. That need was exactly the same, but the expectations of the market started changing. And as the expectations changed, companies adapted to this ever changing speed of the customer and provided more and more innovation in the form of automobiles. And you know, nowadays we’ve got electric cars, right? If you think about it, essentially they’re still solving the same basic need that was there from the very beginning. It was being solved by a horse previously. Right? So what the experience, what I consider to be the experience in the business sense is the way that the company is providing the need of the customer according to their ever-changing expectations in the market. This goes from before the moment of purchase, the moment the customer realizes that he or she has a need, all the way to way after that purchase or transaction has concluded. Even once the relationship with the company has so-called ended, the customer continues to have expectations about that brand and about that company. So that’s what I consider the experience: The sum of the interactions that work together to provide the solution to the need according to the customer’s expectations. I know it’s a little bit confusing. That is how we see it.

Gabe Larsen (10:27):
It does seem like, and that goes back to almost my original question and maybe that fits in a little bit, right? There are different points in the customer journey, and oftentimes we have focused on one versus the other, but if you really map out that customer journey, it is pretty long, right? There are different touch points and there’s ultimately different things that drive that overall experience and therefore loyalty or satisfaction that really does drive people to again come back, repeat, you know, grow with you, stick with you, etc. Interesting. I’ve got a noodle on that one for a minute… That kind of customer experience versus customer service idea.

Mary Drummond (11:09):
Well i’ll build on it if you want. So when you have customer service, what you’re speaking of is a very particular moment or aspect of the experience, which is the relationship. So customer service is the relationship that the company builds with their customer. And relationship is crucial, it’s really, really important. But it is one of the multiple factors that ultimately affect the customer’s decision to choose to do business with your company or with another one that’s out there. So there are quite a few factors. So if we say customer experience is customer service, it is not, but customer service is definitely experiential. It’s definitely part of the experience.

Gabe Larsen (12:02):
But it is just part of it. It’s not the whole experience. The whole experience is… Well, paint that picture. So of customer experiences, what are some of the other parts of the experience that aren’t encompassed in customer service? For example:

Mary Drummond (12:17):
If we’re speaking of attending the need, right? So you talk about the need, you have to have a product, right? So when someone purchases a product, there are two like really easy cost-benefit factors that we can take into consideration there, which is quality versus price. So we always kind of make that relation, you know, like okay, I’m going to pay this much to gain this benefit. And pricing is so complex that there are whole schools of business that focus entirely on pricing. It really is very, very complex. But what we do know is that it’s not always directly related to quality. It is at times, but there are other things that affect it, like relationship is definitely one of them. People will pay more for a company that they have a good relationship with. Because it’s important to them, right? So just to kind of explain it really quick, what we believe in is that there are decision drivers and all of these decision drivers put together drives the customer to decide on how much of each they need in order to have a positive experience or negative experience. But it depends on the customer’s need and the expectation that they set for that company. So if I’m an Apple customer and I go to buy an iPhone, am I looking for price? No, I’m not looking for price. I’m not price sensitive. They are the most expensive. What am I looking for? I am probably looking for really good quality and probably looking for a very easy experience. So low effort in usability factors. Right? But there’s also something huge that’s a lot less subjective, let’s say, then price and quality, which is social proof. How you’re perceived by your tribe or by the people that surround you. So take it this way. I don’t know what phone you have, but I get really upset when I’m in a group chat and there’s that one person with a Google phone that’s making all of my text bubbles green. I’m like, just stop it already. Just go away. Stop ruining my group text.

Gabe Larsen (14:36):
I’ve got to stop you because I was having problems with the app. I have this total dovetail. It’s only five seconds, but I was that person. I literally was that person. I switched to a Samsung, or Android, I don’t know what it was. But I switched and the whole executive team at my last company, I hope they’re listening, they were all on Apple. And honestly, you would have thinked, you would have think you would have thunked. You wish you would’ve thought, that I killed the president or something. I’m dead serious. There was like a revolt. They were just like, you SOB, you mother***, we won’t put up for this. We won’t stand for it. And I got peer pressured back. So now, I mean, you’re not seeing this, but I’m holding this up for Mary. I’m back on an iPhone because I got guilty. So, sorry for the for the thing, but yes, I know what you’re talking about.

Mary Drummond (15:33):
Do you see how strong social proof is? It’s a huge motivator. And another one that’s also more subjective is brand identification. So one thing that we’ve seen recently, and you know, it’s been all over the news, is brands taking a more active stance politically and standing behind their beliefs and really making strong statements that maybe 20 years ago companies wouldn’t dare do. Oh my God, talk about something controversial. No way. But the truth is that the generations of today, they really want to stand behind something that matters to them. You know, so you have companies, I’ll give two, Nike is an example of a company that stood strongly behind what they believed in with the Kaepernick campaign that they ran last year. Or what was it, 2018? And analysts were freaking out, “Oh Nike… they’re really gonna take a hit for that.”

Mary Drummond (16:28):
And it was actually very successful, but it really could have gone either way. The truth is that Nike did some really, really deep research and they knew who their customers were and they knew that their customers would back them up even though they would lose some customers. The customers that actually mattered to them would stick around and actually create a stronger emotional connection with the brand because of that. I remember when that whole thing happened and people started burning their Nike’s. I remember going onto my phone as I’m watching the news go to Nike’s website and ordering anything. I just ordered anything because I just wanted Nike to see that people were still going to buy from them, you know? So I’m like, I’m going to buy right here just to show Nike how much I care.

Gabe Larsen (17:14):
So what do you feel like? And some of these examples are extremely powerful. Are there certain things that you’ve found that are the typical drivers to kind of get this? I mean, it sounds like, you know, price quality. You’ve listed a couple. Is there a typical list that you’re like, Gabe, these are the normal ones that companies need to be thinking about to drive that overall satisfaction?

Mary Drummond (17:35):
Yeah, we have five. Now these are the ones that we… So we did tons of scientific research and we narrowed it down to five, and these five drivers, they’re the main influencers of purchase decisions. Now, as you changed the decision, because you see the things that we make decisions all day long and ultimately on a daily basis, we’re constantly weighing out cost benefit. Let’s say, let’s call it cost benefit to decide whether or not something is worth it. So I’m going to give you an example. Waking up at 6:00 AM to go to the gym. Do you want to do it? Hell no. Hell no. Today it was raining so hard in Atlanta and I got out of bed and I’m like dragging myself out of bed. I’m like, I’m going to the gym. Did I want to? No.

Mary Drummond (18:21):
But in my mind, I’m telling myself that the benefits that I’m going to obtain from that sacrifice, what I’m giving up is worth it. So I go and I do it. So every moment in our lives, whenever we’re faced with a crossroad, we weigh out price, which can be money, it can be effort, it can be a sacrifice of morals. There are a series of things that we can do as paying a price in order to gain a benefit. And what does that benefit? It can be a better body. It could be health, it can be anything. So when it comes to purchase decisions, normally we’re giving up money in order to gain a product or service. So what we identified as the five decision drivers or purchase decisions are: Price and quality. It’s not in any specific order… It changes radically according to the customer and the situation. Price and quality, relationship, social proof, and brand identification. Each of the five things that I brought up.

Gabe Larsen (19:24):
Oh, price and quality are one. Okay. Got it. Okay, so say it one more time, one more time just so I got them. So, price and quality…

Mary Drummond (19:30):
Price, quality, relationship, that’s where you come in, right? Social proof, and brand identification. Depending on how these five factors… depending on how they weigh out in a customer’s minds, you can either increase one in order to improve that perception of a good experience, or reduce them in case it’s causing a bad experience. So if your customer has a really good impression of you and you don’t know why, you can run a Worthix survey and find out what’s causing that good impression so you can boost it.

Gabe Larsen (20:03):
Hmm, and really focus on one of those key drivers, right? Because I did like what you had mentioned pre-show, like oftentimes you guys were running these MPS survey and I’m just using MPS an example. But you know, it’s like, “Overall how satisfied are you?” And then you’re like, I don’t know what to do with that.

Mary Drummond (20:22):
Satisfaction doesn’t actually lead ultimately to the buying.

Gabe Larsen (20:24):
Well, I just love the idea of like when you talk about those drivers, I’m like, I can do something with that. I can coach my people. They can own it. We can do something. But satisfaction does feel like it’s so, uh oh, well they’re not sad. Then you gotta dive down more and more, so I like the action of building.

Mary Drummond (20:45):
Satisfaction is great if you’re doing a conformity check, right? So like I’ve got expectations as a customer, is that company living up to my expectations, yes or no? If the answer is yes, then I’m satisfied. If it’s not then no. Now am I going to leave you because I’m not satisfied?

Gabe Larsen (21:04):
Personally, I don’t believe that someone… it’s probably is all over the board. Some people, yes. Some people, no. I don’t know if it’s predictive of what we’re talking about here.

Mary Drummond (21:18):
It’s not because it’s only one factor. So if the price is really, really good, I might stay with you even if you suck. If I’m looking to buy like family heirloom that I want to pass onto my daughter when she grows up, I’m probably not going to measure the price because what I’m looking for is quality. I’m looking for durability, I’m looking for something that’s going to withstand the test of time, right? If I’m looking for a quick fix, something that I’m going to use one or two times, why on earth would I spend all this money for something temporary? So I’ll sacrifice quality, then I’ll probably sacrifice relationship cause all I want is this product for like whatever you know a party. Now what happens is… I’m a customer of Comcast. Okay, this this like the perfect example, because Comcast is known for having truly terrible relationship with their customers right now. Why is it that after five years with Comcast, I am still with Comcast even though their relationship sucks? Because I don’t need to call them that often.

Gabe Larsen (22:23):
It’s quality. It’s finding this balance between the different drivers.

Mary Drummond (22:29):
And when I think about the effort that I’ll have to leave Comcast and go to their competition, and then is there competition going to be that much better? Not necessarily, right? So in that specific example of Comcast, I’m not going to leave. But then again, internet isn’t a market that’s that commoditized. You don’t have that many players out there. It’s not like retail where you have hundreds of options. So depending on the industry you’re in, if you’re in an ultra commoditized market where price isn’t a differentiator, nor is quality, then you really have to stand out on other things like relationship.

Gabe Larsen (23:06):
You start to play those different games, yeah.

Mary Drummond (23:09):
And that’s where you have to innovate, truly innovate in the experience. So, you know, an example that I give all the time is Chewy. I don’t know if you know who Chewy is, it’s like a subscription for pet food. It’s like the most basic thing in the world. Chewy doesn’t sell cheap dog food. They’re more expensive than Amazon. They don’t sell super high quality or any different quality than all of the other pet stores out there. They’re selling the exact same products everybody else is selling. So an ultra commoditized market. How does Chewy get their customers to stay with them? How do they guarantee that loyalty if they’re not different at all in price and quality? Well, they really work hard on their customer service. They really work hard in their relationship. They like cultivate this intimate relationship with their customers. They’ll write handwritten cards. My dog got a birthday card! A birthday card in the mail from Chewy! These are these little things that make a difference.

Gabe Larsen (24:22):
Fascinating. Fascinating. So these companies got to find the different things that really drive their differentiators or behaviors, which really can separate them in the market. And you’ve narrowed it down to five doesn’t mean you have to do one could do the other. It’s about finding what’s unique in your industry and potentially commoditize a non-commoditized market. Well, Mary, that was not what I expected. I had like 10 more questions we’re going to have to bring you on again next time. But I really like this idea of experience looking at the whole journey and then the drivers that potentially drive that and you obviously narrowed it down to five. I’m going to have to think a little bit about that.

Gabe Larsen (25:02):
So as we wrap, if someone wants to get in touch with you or learn a little bit more about what y’all do over there at Worthix, what’s the best way to do that?

Mary Drummond (25:13):
Okay, well I’m on Twitter and LinkedIn and Instagram and everywhere is like @drummondmary, it’s really easy to find me. I’m like the one and only. You find some other people, but they look very sketchy. So don’t go with them. I’m like the one and only @drummondmary who looks like a person that would give you lots of interesting thought leadership.

Gabe Larsen (25:32):
So don’t follow them, follow her.

Mary Drummond (25:34):
Don’t follow them. You can also find me on Medium if that’s where you get your fix. And worthix.com to learn more about Worthix.

Gabe Larsen (25:42):
I love it. I love it. Well, it does it seem like a cool technology.I love the talk track and I’m looking forward to interacting more. Thanks again for joining and I wish everybody a fantastic day.

Exit Voice (25:58):
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